Immortals Handbook Epic Bestiary (now available)

[Upper_Krust]

Hey Alzrius mate!

I do indeed like it. I think it still captures the feel of the original font used, while still being much more legible.

I agree, its legible but still funky.

Also, U_K, bear in mind that I'm headed to Gen Con, so from mid-afternoon (my time) Wednesday, August 9th through Monday, August 14th, I'll be out of touch.

Thats okay mate, if anything goes wrong while you're away I know who to blame.

...oh, and have fun!

 

[Alzrius]

The publisher informed me that the Distributors don't like the current Bestiary Cover. So they want something a bit more standard fare, big full cover illustration and so forth.

You think Mongoose would just be willing to fork over the dough to pay someone else to do a cover, instead of dumping that responsibility on you.

Thats okay mate, if anything goes wrong while you're away I know who to blame.

Story of my life.

...oh, and have fun!

It's Gen Con my friend, that goes without saying.

 

[Ltheb Silverfrond]

U_K!
Geez, can't catch a break with the bestiary can you?
I can understand their concerns about the cover though. I took a couple classes in printing and I know that if you are forking out the money to have a full color cover, you better have a lot of colors and a large image, because running and troubleshooting such a large press just wouldn't seem logical for a mostly-black (or white) cover.
I actually prefer the black (Or white) cover idea myself, as it gives the work a more dignified look rather than "we are just advertising." Though the illustration is very nice. Seraphim for the win! ( I feel bad for the Amilictli though, he never had a chance. And the Tarrasque cowering in the corner is priceless)
It is kind of lame of them to keep throwing it back to you, instead of reviewing it once and then showing you all the corrections so it can be done in one batch.

 

[GQuail]

Basically I have to redo the cover bigger and better.

Hmm. Well, they pay the bills, so if they want a bigger cover, they get a bigger cover.

A lot of what's sold the Immortals Handbook on ENWorld is the years of banter on the topic here. I guess they might feel that to people who haven't heard of it you need a more stand-out cover to get their attention. <shrugs> Ours is not to reason why.

The second update (the 21st) I probably could have had all the text done.

However, I may need to pull this Ascension cover out of the bag sharpish. Then again I may not. I'll not know exactly what the new schedule is for a couple of days.

Well, I'm sure if people get something on the predetermined date it will give them something to chew on whilst you go do arty duties. If later updates are later than expected, I'm sure people will appreciate the hassle re: the Bestiary print edition has been a part of a lot of this.

Still, it does make me wonder: is it worth looking at getting someone else to take over art duties on this project? Every day you spend on a picture is a day you could be spending on the actual rules, an d if the Bestiary is just the first of many print versions of products it looks like we can only see the same situation repeating again and again, as demands on the new PDF and new book will always clash. Whilst I don't dislike the art in the IH as it stands, and appreciate that you are a one-man band to some extent :> I do think that splitting off some of the art duties might be a good way to recoup some time.

Yes, this does mean getting someone else involved, and the hilarious money-splitting issues that arise. It's not a perfect idea: just an idea. ;-)

I'm still looking forward to Ascension, for what it's worth. But I don't think my 10th level D&D party are. ;-)

 

[Cheiromancer]

I don't think the distributors should be able to dictate artistic decisions to you. What next- are they going to complain that the CRs of the monsters are too high? sheesh.

Go with what you have, that's what I say.

 

[GQuail]

I don't think the distributors should be able to dictate artistic decisions to you. What next- are they going to complain that the CRs of the monsters are too high? sheesh.

Go with what you have, that's what I say.

To be fair, I don't think it's unfair for distributors to raise some comments, especially about the front cover: which has an undeniable influence on sales, and thusly, the money they see back. Consider also that whilst the imprint is new, I imagine some of the staff running it are RPG hacks, who may feel they have some insights into what sells better than U_K: who, a prodigy though he is, is thus far an /unprinted/ prodigy. ;-)

George Q

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey GQuail mate!

Hmm. Well, they pay the bills, so if they want a bigger cover, they get a bigger cover.

Exactly. I totally don't mind having to redo the cover if thats what the distributors want.

The main problem for me is that setting the release back means setting back when I get paid by a large margin (3 months, due to quarterly payments). Given that I am basically living on borrowed time as it is financially speaking, the setback is going to cause me major problems.

A lot of what's sold the Immortals Handbook on ENWorld is the years of banter on the topic here. I guess they might feel that to people who haven't heard of it you need a more stand-out cover to get their attention. <shrugs> Ours is not to reason why.

Indeed. obviously the distributors know what sells and what doesn't, although it might have been nice to know from the start, especially after doing those extra two paintings to extend the original image.

Well, I'm sure if people get something on the predetermined date it will give them something to chew on whilst you go do arty duties. If later updates are later than expected, I'm sure people will appreciate the hassle re: the Bestiary print edition has been a part of a lot of this.

Well I can only do my best under the circumstances.

Still, it does make me wonder: is it worth looking at getting someone else to take over art duties on this project? Every day you spend on a picture is a day you could be spending on the actual rules, and if the Bestiary is just the first of many print versions of products it looks like we can only see the same situation repeating again and again, as demands on the new PDF and new book will always clash. Whilst I don't dislike the art in the IH as it stands, and appreciate that you are a one-man band to some extent :> I do think that splitting off some of the art duties might be a good way to recoup some time.

Well I don't see the point of getting someone to do a job I can do, unless they would be better. Which almost certainly means hiring a professional, and I don't see any professional agreeing to wait around to be paid AFTER I get paid.

Yes, this does mean getting someone else involved, and the hilarious money-splitting issues that arise. It's not a perfect idea: just an idea. ;-)

They would probably want the money up front, and the only thing I have to pay them with is monopoly money at the moment.

I'm still looking forward to Ascension, for what it's worth. But I don't think my 10th level D&D party are. ;-)

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey Cheery mate!

I don't think the distributors should be able to dictate artistic decisions to you.

The people with the money always call the shots, the people without (ie. me) don't. It's not like I am Monte Cook...not yet anyway.

Like I said to GQuail, I don't mind redoing the cover, its just the timing is awkward (vis a vis Ascension) and the financial setback is bordering on scary.

Other than those two things I am pretty cool with it.

What next- are they going to complain that the CRs of the monsters are too high? sheesh.

I hardly think so, thats one debate I would surely win.

Go with what you have, that's what I say.

Were such an option on the table...

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hello again mate!

To be fair, I don't think it's unfair for distributors to raise some comments, especially about the front cover: which has an undeniable influence on sales, and thusly, the money they see back. Consider also that whilst the imprint is new, I imagine some of the staff running it are RPG hacks, who may feel they have some insights into what sells better than U_K: who, a prodigy though he is, is thus far an /unprinted/ prodigy. ;-)

I can't speak for the distributors, but I know I have had nothing but support from Mongoose and their people. But I imagine even such as they answer to higher powers, and I can totally understand things from their perspective.

On the brightside I get to do a massive kick-@ss cover painting.

I think it will still have the same theme, Amilictli vs. Seraphim* and an imperiled castle. But probably a much more dynamic slugfest.

*with cowering Tarrasque.

I'm also going to be working the painting at 200% (Roughly 60 x 40 cm) which should give me better detail when I shrink it down. Normally I work at 150%. Although this is going to mean a quodruple scan needing to be pieced together via photoshop.

The only thing I am not totally sure about at this stage is the new graphic Immortals Handbook logo/text for the front cover. I'm not as confident doing one of those shiny pseudo-metal logos.

 

[Ltheb Silverfrond]

U_K!
Re-doing the whole cover eh? Nice. A pain maybe, but now is the chance to really surprise everyone. (I think it may be funny to have a tornado as part of the sceanery, and the Tarrasque running away from it, paniced, but it's back end being pulled up into it. See reference - the Movie Twister - the cows )
Metallic logo huh? Photoshop is pretty good for that stuff, if you are familiar with filters, layer styles, and the Gradient tool. Use the gradient fill tool on a layer made via an outline of the text itself. Set type to Noise, and get the aproximate coloration you want. Randomize it a bit, and experiment. I did a logo for a poster like that, and it looked quite nice.
Mine looked more like a futuristic gun-metal look in the end, rivets and all. I dont think thats what you are looking for, so a varied coloration may help. A gold/silver tint may help. A light (5-10% opacity) lense flair on the "middle curve" on some parts of metallic lettering makes it look a bit more 3D too.
Good luck on Ascension. Not to scare you, but it's 6 days away from the post-post-prerelease.