Improvements after 3.5

[The_Fan]

When 3.5 first came out, I was all in favor. I had already begun to see the seams in 3.0 despite having played it for only a year. Now that we've had 3.5 for a while, I've seen a constant steady improvement...and it bothers me.

Just a small list of the brilliant ideas that have continued to improve the game since the release of 3.5:
Immediate actions
Swift actions
New PrC format
New stat block
New item format
New spell format (Spell Compendium)
New skill uses
Etc.

It seems like every other release has a new improvement...that should've been core to begin with. I'm not talking about things like teamwork benefits, the new psionics system, substitution levels, or the Warlock class, (which, while admittedly brilliant, should be optional) but basic quality-of-life improvements to the system like those mentioned above. I can't help but feel that some of these improvements would have made it into the core had it been delayed until 2005 as originally planned.

Does anyone else feel the way I do?

 

[I'm A Banana]

Yup.

The game is continually evolving in its' own house, which is a good thing. As long as the SRD is a living, breathing, changing document, it's got eternal relevance. It's when the words become immutable gospel that the game outstrips its rules.

 

[Henry]

It seems like every other release has a new improvement...that should've been core to begin with...basic quality-of-life improvements to the system like those mentioned above. I can't help but feel that some of these improvements would have made it into the core had it been delayed until 2005 as originally planned.

That seems too cynical a mindset for me. It's entirely, just entirely, possible that, because they're humans, and fallible, that these changes were implemented in hindsight. No one can have all their good thoughts at once, and there has to be a deadline past which changes cannot be made to a product. Considering that 3.5's core books were printed almost two years ago, information formats strike me as evolutionary in form, rather than pre-planned teasers.


Look at it this way -- haven't you ever had a project at work or school that you handed in, and then a week later realized out of the blue there was a minor change you wish you'd made? If George Lucas can screw with his movies 25 years after the fact, surely there's room for a tweak in D&D here and there.

 

[GlassJaw]

Immediate actions
Swift actions
New PrC format
New stat block
New item format
New spell format (Spell Compendium)
New skill uses

Well the "formats" aren't really any new rules, just alternate ways of presenting existing rules. No biggie IMO.

As far as Immediate and swift actions go, I don't use those at all (and I don't think I know where to find said rules, Miniatures Handbook maybe?) so I wouldn't call those a change to the core rules. New skill uses? Ehh, I guess. But I tend to call for skill checks for things beyond what's in the PHB all the time on the fly so that's no big deal to me. If the PC's have a cool idea, I'll make the skills work.

the Warlock class, (which, while admittedly brilliant, should be optional)

You mean I'm required to use the Warlock! Uh oh! The WotC police are going to hunt me down because I didn't buy Complete Whatever!

Does anyone else feel the way I do?

Not really. My example was a bit over the top but everything you mentioned is optional IMO.

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

I'll agree that it's an evolving game. That ideas are continually being developed is a sign of health. I think it's always been the case, but the powers that be are a little more formal in their incorporation of these ideas with this edition.

I've a feeling that we're going to see those flaws that have been showing up in Dragon magazine incorporated into the core rules at some point.

What I will disagree with is that all of this is for the better. Some of it is, but a lot of it is just adding complexity on top of complexity. Until WotC releases a D&D book with implicit rules for not using miniatures, not using Attacks of Opportunity, and a simplified or unified skills/feats system, I plan on ignoring most of these additional rules.

 

[Mercule]

Formatting, such as the new stat blocks or spell/item descriptions are not rules. As such, they are neither core nor expansion. They are the layout of a book/magazine/etc. WotC could reprint the extant books and use the new formats, if they wanted, and it wouldn't change the system. All that happened was that someone had an idea and it took hold. For all we know, that person would have been fired or never hired, if they hadn't made 3.5 and had the influx of cash I suspect came with it.

Any conjecture about the issue is shadow boxing and straw men.

 

[diaglo]

all of those improvements were available since OD&D.

YMMV

 

[Shade]

The monster formats change in nearly every release, too, but usually are ever-so-subtle.

I really like most of the improvements (although I loathe the new prestige class format), so I say keep 'em coming.

Look at it this way -- haven't you ever had a project at work or school that you handed in, and then a week later realized out of the blue there was a minor change you wish you'd made? If George Lucas can screw with his movies 25 years after the fact, surely there's room for a tweak in D&D here and there.

Well played.

As far as Immediate and swift actions go, I don't use those at all (and I don't think I know where to find said rules, Miniatures Handbook maybe?) so I wouldn't call those a change to the core rules.

They are actually in the SRD now, so that's about as core as you can get.

 

[jmucchiello]

They are actually in the SRD now, so that's about as core as you can get.

Well what do you know? Hiding in the Powers Overview file. What a perfect place for them?

 

[Samothdm]

Well what do you know? Hiding in the Powers Overview file. What a perfect place for them?

Interesting...I had never caught that they were in there. Apparently that means that 3rd Party Publishers can now use Swift and Immediate actions in their publications?