(IR) 1st ooc-thread of the 5th IR (open)

[Rikandur Azebol]

I repeat. I allow Edena to post my @mail. BUt Iuz will take care of spammers.

And how ended common cause with Iuz empire, Edena ?

 

[Serpenteye]

Serpenteye,

Can we carpet bomb armys/citys/stuff with spelljamming ships? Also, how much power are
we talking about with a spelljamming faction... would they be able to realistically war? Exactly how many ships could we have access to? Would a "army" translate to a single ship? Would we have to worry about having enough ships to transport our armys to Oearth? Could we go in multiple trips if we needed to?

Carpet bomb... If you get enough semi-modern explosives by researching Tech, yes. Gunpowder isn't teally potent enough for any significant carpet bombing comparable to the bombings of ww2.

You proabably wouldn't have a very big army at the beginning, enough for raiding and outflanking the enemies of your allies, perhaps, but not enough to win a major land-war by yourself. Your air-force is your main strength, and it functions much like the airforces in the real world, able to harass and hurt the enemy, but not conquer or annihilite him completely.

You may well have access to your own moon or planet, but the world in question would be a lot less inhabitable and/or smaller than Oerth.

You can build up a conventional army, in which case you could ferry it over to Oerth gradually. I'll wing it when it comes up.

You know quite well which United Kingdom I was referring to.

That's a relief. Having dragons take over the UK would probably be bordering on copyright-infringement.

Hey SerpentEye,

Any chance we could get a link to the most current version of the rules in the first post of this thread?

Some of the rules are being reconsidered right now, specifically the rules about PL-creation. When the rules are finished I'll post them in one of my reserved posts on page one.

I haven't got any idea what an sblock tag is.
Perhaps Creamsteak could alter my post into a post with sblock tags?
Or perhaps another player could copy my post, and divy it up into sblock tags?
I can't. My regrets. And yes, it is a really long post.

All I can do is update the megapost above. That is what I am doing right now, as a matter of fact. I am studying each post in turn, then modifying the megapost as appropriate in a second Navigator window.

I will not post a new megapost. I will only update the first megapost above. That will prevent the thread from being cluttered by such megaposts, and everyone can simply refer back to my first megapost to see where things stand.

Yours Sincerely
Edena_of_Neith

I will eventually re-post your compilation when the game is closed for new players and the list is completed. Don't worry about the sblocks, it's one of the new formatting tools on the boards and I don't really know myself how they work. It is a convenient way of hiding text, though.

Still in and permission granted for my email address.

Now for the volumes of posts to read -- you folks were busy this weekend!!!!

Good to hear. I was getting worried about you. Your faction is very important to the game. The Great Kingdom needs strong neigbours to limit its expansion.

If need be by a significant amount of players I'll convert these docs to pdf or something, but I think that as a word doc I've got the most clarity in this compilation going. I think the player list is up to date so far (as of 1100CST), but I could be wrong. Still haven't gone over a lot of the addendums and put them into the main document and gone through and clarified the rules from my last communication with Serpenteye.

Download at your pleasure.

This puts the rules in a new perspective, and could be a very useful help in explaining how they work.

Hey there, Devilish. Nice to meet you!
...
And, heh, in that IR Serpenteye and Mr. Draco nuked Maudlin's power. So beware! Nice trust those Aerdians. Not at all. Not at all ...

Has anyone seen Darwin Of Mind? Forrester? Tokiwong? I miss them. : (

Knight Otu on the other hand, has quite a good record as a fair and honest player...

The players you mentioned would all be great additions to the 5th IR. Forrester and Tokiwong were major players in the 3rd IR and Darwin played an important part in the first two.
I have my doubts that Forrester would be interested in playing a game with me as the DM, he made quite a lot of derogatory remarks about my person and probably doesn't regard me very highly. But in case you're reading this Forrester, you're welcome to join the game.

James, I've now updated the megapost containing the player roster up to this post I'm writing now.
I think the idea of a .doc is great. I'll check it out. Kudos, James!
A .doc you can just click on is a lot easier than scrolling through pages of text and awkward, endless megaposts.

I'll keep updating the one megapost at the start of this thread, so you can update (??? - that'll help, right?) the .doc.

Yours Truly
Edena_of_Neith

P:S Stupid Macintosh computers. I can't download .docs. However, I can download PDFs, if you use that format. I'll keep the megalist up, in case we have players who can download neither.

I'll have my own post coming up today, which may help to clarify things a little.
-
Edena, I PMed you on Nothingland last night like you requested. Did you get my message?

 

[Knight Otu]

Knight Otu on the other hand, has quite a good record as a fair and honest player...

Great, now everyone will exploit my fairness and honesty.

 

[Airwhale]

Edena:
If the problem is that you are using Safari, and not that you don't have MS word, you might want to try Mozilla's Firefox http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/

SerpentEye, Zelda:

So, I've been thinking, The main thing I want is just knowing that, should Zelda and I pick a spelljamming faction (Or a collalition of them), that we would not be in any poorer shape than a major faction. Sure, there would be tradeoffs, but I want to be relatively balanced, say, against the Scarlet brotherhood, the drow, and Iuz.

All:
Some rules questions:

The Industry rating of a province is related to it's population. Is the population set? Does it grow? Does it have a max? Can it be increased by magic? (It can obviously be removed by magic =) )



I'm concerned that infiltration may be too powerful. At the very least, I'm confused by it. For 10 PP, you can buy 5 IC in a province. If you have 100% of the province, which gives you half an IC per PP spent. If you have 50%, then that gives you a quarter IC... etc.

Now, for the same 10pp, you can subvert 10IC from a province. This has the added benefit of removing 10IC from one of your opponents. I am confused about how the d20 die roll works for control... can anyone explain that to me?

Assuming you will win the die roll, that gives you 1 IC per 1pp, plus removes 1 IC from other empires in the area. If you have the special trait, you get 2IC per 1pp

Now, more questions:

If a province you have control of is subverted, wouldn’t you know automatically just from the reduced PP you get from it? Can you subvert your own provinces? Do you always know how much control you have over your province? If you gain 10th level magic, does that just remove spies or does it also help you regain control of your economy? Is it possible to place spies in organizations, or just provinces? (I recall that some of the organizations don't really have a home base, per say, correct?)

Questions on war and armys:
Are regular armys tied to an area? Are elite and epic?

Let’s say we have 10,000,000 regular armys fighting 1 epic army. All other modifiers are the same. Now, the epic army will always roll higher than the regular one, right? +8/+7+1D6 vs. +0/+0+1D6. Since casuilities are only taken when one side rolls lower then the other, the epic will never take any casulties. Thus, the 1 epic army will win vs. an infinite number of militia and regular armys, correct? Is this working as intended? Did I miss something?

How do you calcuate war if one side has a mix of armys?

 

[Serpenteye]

 The amount of power you invest into the province directly, at the beginning of each turn, determines the maximum amount of IC the province will give you next season. 1 power point invested gives you ½ points of IC, 10 PP invested gives 5 IC, etc. (½PPI + PPT = PPnt)
PPI = Power Points Invested
PPT = Power Points per Turn (from IC only)
PPnt = Power Points Next Turn

I’ve been told that my formula is incorrect currently?

The formula is correct.

 Dead Magic Zones are disastrous for units that rely upon magic. Elite units get a modifier of –2 to defense and attack and Epic units get a modifier of –4 to defense and attack.
Note to Serpenteye: I assume that there needs to be a clarification that those modifiers come solely from the ranks of the bonuses gained from magic and divine bonuses, else there needs to be a separate lesser modifier that shows the lack of access to 0-9th level magic only.

The negative modifiers in the quote affect Elite and Epic PLs. Nearly all Elite and Epic PLs rely on magic in one form or another for their effectiveness, whereas regular PLs use of magic is a lot less significant. That's the rationale for the rule.
Neither the bonuses gained from High Magics or Deities or Druidic magic apply to anyone in a Dead Magic Zone. Other penalties may apply as circumstances dictate, and I claim the right to rule that on the spot.

Magic of such extreme power and difficulty is beyond the grasp of most people. Only your Epic PLs can be used to research the Higher level spells, and they are permanently spent by doing so. No magic has the power to bring them back to life.

Note to Serpenteye: Not even more powerful spell levels?

No, that would either cause a lot more paperwork for me or give the factions an inexhaustable source of a higher and higher score in the magical arms race with no cost to themselves.

Example of Play: Redgar the Mighty has 600,000 inhabitants in his faction, a tech level of 5, and is producing 15 PP each turn. It requires 100 Power Points to raise Redgar’s lowly militia up to the Epic fighting force that he needs to establish so that Redgar can access 10th level magic. That means that at a minimum Redgar will need 5,000 (50x100 PPs) Power Points to research 10th level spells, and he will be sacrificing 100 Epic PL units with a minimum normal strength of +9/+8 each. It will require almost 340 turns (a little over 80 years) for Redgar to fully engage in such research if he starts with only Militia PLs. Once he gains access to 10th level magic and wishes to engage in 11th level magic research he must begin again from scratch, this time needing 20,000 (200x100PPs) Power Points! Obviously Redgar needs to start considering his options for conquest.

That looks correct, but you do not need Militia PLs to create Regular PLs, you can create those directly from your industrial capacity.

If Redgar put some PPts into increasing his technological score and invested more in upgrading his IC he would be able to get 10th level magic quite a bit sooner.

 Affect an area the size of the Kevellond League, causing widespread death and destruction but leaving most common people alive.

Since there is no Kevellond League anymore, we should make this "the Empire of Iuz" or "an area the size of 1/5th to 1/6th of the Flannaes"

 The Alien Trait gives a cumulative bonus of +5 to the opposed roll both for defending his influence and expanding it in a territory where he has a greater percentage of control than any other faction.

Note to Serpenteye: I’m unclear what this circumstance is exactly and how it is applied.

It's applied in areas where the Alien faction is already dominant. Since Infiltration is gradual this trait will give factions who are psychologically very different from the norm a bonus to defence and attack in their own provinces or provinces that they have managed to inflitrate to a high degree.
It helps them consolidate the hold on their own territory but doesn't give them bonuses to taking over territories from others. When they have taken over a territory to become the most powerful faction in it this trait will apply, but not before then.

---

Great addendums. It really helps me to have all my thoughts in the same place (especially when my brain explodes ).

 

[devilish]

Hey there, Devilish. Nice to meet you!

Hi Edena!

Did you know you have a similar situation to what Maudlin had with Serpenteye (and Mr. Draco) in the 3rd IR? Except in this case, Knight Otu is running Aerdi, while you are playing Acererak. In the 3rd IR, Serpenteye and Mr. Draco played Aerdi, and Maudlin played Acererak.
And, heh, in that IR Serpenteye and Mr. Draco nuked Maudlin's power. So beware! Nice trust those Aerdians. Not at all. Not at all ...

Didn't Maudlin ally himself immediately with Vecna early, though?
Tsk tsk tsk....

Not a rush or nag question -- but is the background up for the IR? I remember
reading in the last post about a rogue Steam-wielding Pit Fiend, but why did
the Gods close off the Sphere? Is the storyline the same as the 3rd IR?

Thanks,
-D

 

[Serpenteye]

SerpentEye, Zelda:

So, I've been thinking, The main thing I want is just knowing that, should Zelda and I pick a spelljamming faction (Or a collalition of them), that we would not be in any poorer shape than a major faction. Sure, there would be tradeoffs, but I want to be relatively balanced, say, against the Scarlet brotherhood, the drow, and Iuz.

Your faction would be different, but yes I believe it would be viable.
Your geographic (or should I say cosmological) position is such that your home provinces are only really vulnerable to attack from Elite and Epic PLs, which will be relatively rare in the beginning. Against such an attacker you would be able to put both a considerable Elite force and a part of your Regular armies. Your advantage compared to the Oerth-bound players is considerable, for they can be invaded by the full force of their enemies armies.
Your strong Elite force will be able to cause considerable damage to your enemies on Oerth. Elite forces are valuable primarily because of their mobility, and are best countered by other Elites and Epics.
Your territory would be middling productive. Less so than the greatest empires on Oerth, but nothing to be ashamed of either.

The Industry rating of a province is related to it's population. Is the population set? Does it grow? Does it have a max? Can it be increased by magic? (It can obviously be removed by magic =) )

Normal population growth for humanoids is too slow to matter in the IR. There are ways to protect your population with magic, by curing disease and providing them with clean food and water and so on. The problem is that few of you have access to clerical magic and that none of you have access to mid-high level clerical spells. Only one player has access to a significant amount of druids...
There may also be ways to magically increase your population-growth, but spells of such power belong in High magic.

I'm concerned that infiltration may be too powerful. At the very least, I'm confused by it. For 10 PP, you can buy 5 IC in a province. If you have 100% of the province, which gives you half an IC per PP spent. If you have 50%, then that gives you a quarter IC... etc.

Now, for the same 10pp, you can subvert 10IC from a province. This has the added benefit of removing 10IC from one of your opponents. I am confused about how the d20 die roll works for control... can anyone explain that to me?

Assuming you will win the die roll, that gives you 1 IC per 1pp, plus removes 1 IC from other empires in the area. If you have the special trait, you get 2IC per 1pp

Whoever rolls highest wins, modifiers included. If the attacker fails he loses all the points he spent on the attack and if he succeeds he takes a bite out of his opponent. But the opponent, since he owns the province (has a greater degree of control than anyone else) gets a substantial bonus (+5) to his d20 roll to defend. And chances are that next turn he will still have a greater degree of control than anyone else and get the same bonus for pushing you out of the province.
Infiltration is risky. Industrialization is safer.
Now, Infiltrator factions (of which we have only two in the game) get a halving of all the costs of infiltration. But they still have to make the roll.

Now, more questions:

If a province you have control of is subverted, wouldn’t you know automatically just from the reduced PP you get from it? Can you subvert your own provinces? Do you always know how much control you have over your province? If you gain 10th level magic, does that just remove spies or does it also help you regain control of your economy? Is it possible to place spies in organizations, or just provinces? (I recall that some of the organizations don't really have a home base, per say, correct?)

You use the same mechanism to solodify your control of your own territories as you do when you inflitrate someone else, but you get a +5 bonus when doing so.
A faction with higher level magic than the infiltrator is immune to infiltration from that faction, so they can easily and cleanly purge all their influence from their own territory.
You always know how much control you have over any and all territories.
Spies can be attached both to organizations and provinces, but you have to find the organization to place a spy in it.

Questions on war and armys:
Are regular armys tied to an area? Are elite and epic?

Let’s say we have 10,000,000 regular armys fighting 1 epic army. All other modifiers are the same. Now, the epic army will always roll higher than the regular one, right? +8/+7+1D6 vs. +0/+0+1D6. Since casuilities are only taken when one side rolls lower then the other, the epic will never take any casulties. Thus, the 1 epic army will win vs. an infinite number of militia and regular armys, correct? Is this working as intended? Did I miss something?

How do you calcuate war if one side has a mix of armys?

Armies are not tied to the territories. PLs are not tied to the territories, it's tied to your faction as a whole.

The Epic army will always win over the Regular, all things being equal. But if the Regular army has substantially higher technology than the Epic army they will be able to damage it. And since Regular PLs are plentiful and Epic PLs are rare they could kill it in one lucky hit.
High level characters in DnD are nearly unkillable for low level characters. That's what my system is trying to model. Elite and Epic armies do have a considerable advantage against Militia and Regulars but killing a huge army takes time, and while their backs are turned they will be vulnerable to attack from other Elite and Epic armies.

When different PLs are mixed I calculate the battle separately for each PL and add up the result every combat round (which is not equivalent to a DnD round, but a bit longer).

 

[Melkor Lord Of ALL!]

Edena, I actually decided to play a Power of my own instead of Solistarim, could you add it to the roster?

Gallador`s Concord: Gallador The Undying King, Master of The Night Eternal is an ancient Vampire who was banished to the Underdark centuries ago . For ages ha has waged a war of conquest and deception, and now with the current dramatic events, his attention is brought back to the surface world!

I would claim:

-Duergar( they have autonomy, but their leaders are bribed, terrorized and compelled by Gallador, like Roman divide and conquer)

-Kua -Toa

-Goblinoids and other servitor races not yet claimed by Creamsteak or Edena.

-Court of The Eternal Night!- Vampire Children of Gallador, organized in feudal/dynastic system-power is usually based on proximity to Gallador, like generations in Vampire: The Masquaerade).

Lesser Undeath Armies.

More information will follow.

 

[Serpenteye]

Not a rush or nag question -- but is the background up for the IR? I remember
reading in the last post about a rogue Steam-wielding Pit Fiend, but why did
the Gods close off the Sphere? Is the storyline the same as the 3rd IR?

Thanks,
-D

No and no . The background-post is not yet up for the IR. I will post it in the very beginning of the game.
The post that you referr to is just an early version of a part of the prologue. I have something much better, and less rambling, in mind.

 

[Melkor Lord Of ALL!]

A request: anyone knows what countries of today existed on Oerth 600 years ago? I need this for my character`s background. When did Iuz arrive on Oerth?