is Dungeons and Dragons still Lame

[DonTadow]

In August I had a lot of hope that 4e will obtain its purpose, and that is bring in the new LOTR folk and some of the MMORPG folk by incorporating elements that they are familiar with (quick healing, tall elves, wizards as damage dealers). Whether I like the elements or not, I don't mind the hobby growing. Its been hard as heck for me to find players.

But will this work?

I started incorporating a lot of 4e elements long before 4e was around. Since I've borrowed what Ive heard and balanced it out. My older brother, an MMORPG guy whom has read the 3.5 players manual front, refuses to play d and d because its uncool. Even after I introduced the additions i made and the 4e stuff he still refused.

The other day was the last day I figure I'd ask him to sit in our game. I invited him over and he said he'd try it out. After he didn't show, I called him an hour into game to see what happened. His response

Dungeons and Dragons is lame and it always will be. No matter what they do to it normal people aren't going to play the game because it has changed a few things.

So like a kid who found out santa was real, I was left kind of wondering if 4e will change the opinion that Dungeons and Dragons is lame that may just be its permanent definition in modern society.

Can 4e's new changes be enough to change public perception? Even among other geeks?

 

[Plane Sailing]

I've edited your title to make it less inflammatory.

Regards,

 

[Rechan]

Among larger society, roleplaying of any fashion is "Lame". To the extent that the SCA "I use foam weapons to beat my friends up, drink beer and yell about wenches" guy is lumped in with D&D players to the general public.

That opinion is similar to other geeks. The public gawks and laughs at the lines of costumed nerds camped outside of the theatres to see Star Wars. Trekkies get it too. And dare I say, the opinion of WoW and other things, to people who know what they are, isn't fabulous; look at the South Park episode dedicated to WoW.

4e will not change the average member of society's opinion, because it's still "Nerd stuff". It involves math, reading books, and playing pretend, which is just odd to the average person as a pass-time.

Inside the Geek umbrella (and under the gamer umbrella), all sides sneer at other sides. When I say "Furry", do you not roll your eyes and sigh? When I say the words "LARP", do you not snicker? Do you not think of pasty frufru goths dressing up and passing notes in a playground at night? There's feuds and stereotypes between geeks, and between gamers.

Among the gamers that I know, D&D is the "lowest common denominator" of tabletops. The Gateway Game, if you will. Everyone who's ever thrown dice knows what a +1 sword is. It's the most widely known, widely played game, and it's the easiest game to find players for. Some gamers sneer at the fact it's Level based, some sneer at its Hack'n'slash focus, others hate how limited it is, and so on.

4e isn't going to change the opinions of those who think "D&D is, and will always be, the lowest common denominator".

4e will possibly do what 3e did: bring into the fold the people who had stopped gaming 2e, and had drifted off. It might alienate some of those people. But it also might attract more young crowds, with shiny, cool stuff.

 

[tombowings]

The title still needs a question mark after it.

 

[Wormwood]

At this point, I'd be more concerned with keeping *existing gamers* interested in playing D&D.

Because there are a lot more options out there---and the hobby is definitely evolving.

 

[Nikosandros]

Can 4e's new changes be enough to change public perception? Even among other geeks?

Why should they? Do you really think that people who deride D&D as lame care about per encounter powers or whether tieflings replaced gnomes as a core race?

 

[jdrakeh]

I think it has an air of "lame", yes. Those of my co-workers who don't play it (the majority) snicker about those co-workers who do play it (five or six that I know of, including two managers). The thing is, I work at a call center where everybody is a bonifed geek of some kind, so it always gets me when the girl whose cube is slathered in collectible Star Trek pin-ups or the guys who has a Conan desktop wallpaper sneers at D&D players. I mean, really -- are they any less lame?

 

[Doug McCrae]

MMORPGs are cooler than RPGs? To me the two activities seem practically identical. Then again, MMORPGs are a lot more popular. That counts for a lot.

 

[ThirdWizard]

MMORPGs are cooler than RPGs? To me the two activities seem practically identical. Then again, MMORPGs are a lot more popular. That counts for a lot.

Video games are less geeky than tabletop games, which are in turn less geeky than LARPing. See the geek hierarchy chart for further details.

 

[Doug McCrae]

Video games are less geeky than tabletop games, which are in turn less geeky than LARPing. See the geek hierarchy chart for further details.

Awesome. Love the text in the bottom box. I'd seen that chart before but I forgot it put videogamers above rpgers.

You've convinced me of something. On the internet. The geek hierarchy chart is as close to irrefutable as it gets.