Is gaming *with* a map and minis really bad?

[theredrobedwizard]

As a partner to this thread, I figured I'd ask the opposite question. Is it really that bad to use a map and minis? Does it bog down combat that much? Are chessex battle-mats really expensive or something? Do they really preclude roleplaying?

What say you, gathered EN World poster-types?

-TRRW

(fake edit: For what it's worth, I even play World of Darkness with a battlemat, just for simplicity.)

 

[KB9JMQ]

We use a map (drawn on Tac-tiles) and DDMs.
I have always liked physical representations for where everything is.
Yeah we think a bit more tactical then we used to but it doesn't slow us down to do so.
I have played with and without maps & minis and just prefer to have them.

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

No, it isn't really bad. It also isn't really essential. I've played both with and withour maps and minis. Each way has its ups and downs.

Sometimes games with maps and minis can start to feel too wargamey. It can bog down when people try to make moves like a chess game, plotting the perfect sequence of steps and final position.

Somtimes games without maps and minis can be difficult to figure out the scene and you discover that your interpretation is very different from the DMs. It can bog down when you have to backtrack because you didn't understand the situation, or worse when arguements break out.

 

[thedungeondelver]

I use Dwarven Forge and Reaper minis every chance I get.

 

[Alnag]

Is it really that bad to use a map and minis? Does it bog down combat that much? Are chessex battle-mats really expensive or something? Do they really preclude roleplaying?

To answer your questions. No. No. Well... yeah. Mins are pretty expensive. At least for me. But I have some anyway. No.

But... I don't use them much. And I will tell you why. The true reason is mobility. If I would be playing at home it would be absolutely different kind of thing. But one have to travel half the city across with public transport. So I usually take PHB only (even if I am DMing) and of course set of dice. We don't use battle-mat, but we use the free dice as reference.

You are d4, you are d6, and these two d10 are goblins. Sometimes (low levels) we can countdown the hitpoints by rotating the dice accordingly.

So the answer is visual reference yes. The according mins and maps no, because the hinder the mobility. (We sometimes play in tearooms and such spaces, or even outside...)

 

[Odhanan]

There's nothing wrong with using maps and minis!

 

[w_earle_wheeler]

It isn't bad. That's how I and everyone I knew did it back in the day. It has never been the "proper" way to play D&D -- which, as everyone here probably knows, started as a tabletop miniatures wargame -- but that's the way we did it.

The downside? Battles can take more time, miniatures are expensive, and if you play outside of the home you have to lug the maps and miniatures around with you. Using counters instead can less that burden a bit. Also, non-tactical minded players generally have an easier time when they can be more free-form.

The upside? Battles can have more detail, the D&D already has many rules designed with tabletop battles in mind (ie, you don't have to exclude rules or worry that a player will choose a feat that is useless without miniature combat), miniatures are cool and we all wanted them as a kid, Dungeon Tiles are cheap, there are less disputes with the DM because everyone can see exactly where they are.

 

[Crothian]

There is nothing bad with using them. It's like anm DM screen it is something that is good for some groups but not good for others.

 

[maddman75]

As I said in the other thread - map and minis good for a tactical game, bad for a cinematic one. Its like asking is chocolate is good for cooking. Sure, if you use it to make some brownies. But I think I'll pass and putting it in my lasagna.

 

[Desdichado]

It isn't really bad, no. It isn't very preferable either, though. When I'm playing a roleplaying game, I don't much like to stop playing the roleplaying game and play a tactical miniatures minigame.

However, I really like d20 because of the depth and breadth of material for it, so rather than convert everything I want into some other system that has a more cinematic combat engine that doesn't require graphical representation on the table, I just make my peace with the battlemat and move on.

One of the things I'd most want to see for 4e (while conversely thinking this is one of the least likely to happen) is a combat engine that is friendlier to being used with just verbal description.