Is it wrong for a game to have an agenda?

[S'mon]

One of the truisms in the study of art and culture is that everything has a political and social message, because people will reflexively frame things according to their political and social biases. So basically, all an agenda does is make this conscious, instead of unconscious or unacknowledged.

(snip)

Otherwise, writing to send a message about something is fine, too. In my experience, you gain about as much audience as you lose. White Wolf gained a whole bunch of new fans just by acknowledging that non-heterosexuals exist and by playing up environmental and political themes. Ultimately, though, thise stuff is a springboard for satisfying gaming.

I agree with this post - all writing is influenced by the author's POV and an explicit agenda as in the RPG The Price of Freedom isn't IMO better or worse than an unacknowledged one as in Twilight:2000. I guess D&D's "self-aggrandisement is the ultimate good" message is a particularly universal one, though.

 

[MonsterMash]

Do games that have agends bother you (you referring to everyone on EN world)? Would you care, and play the game if it was good dispite the games agenda or would the agenda turn you off and no matter how good the game is never touch it?

Games having an Agenda does not bother me, but if I don't like the agenda then it could turn me off and mean that I wouldn't pick up the game.

After all a game set in the eighteenth century where players were slave traders would not appeal to me no matter how well it was done or Concentration Camp Commander the RPG.

 

[mossfoot]

But I'm publishing this setting and putting it out on the market. So, it is not just my players that are effected by it because I'm making it availible for everyone to use and read.

Do games that have agends bother you (you referring to everyone on EN world)? Would you care, and play the game if it was good dispite the games agenda or would the agenda turn you off and no matter how good the game is never touch it?

I think JRR Tolkien said it best. Granted he was refering to fiction writing, but let's face it, it applies to ALL stories. Movies, books, RPG... People asked him if Lord of the Rings was an allegory for World War 2 and he said (cobbled together by Google)

"I cordially dislike allegory in all its manifestations, and always have done since I grew old and wary enough to detect its presence. I much prefer history, true or feigned, with its varied applicability to the thought and experience of readers. I think many confuse 'applicability' with 'allegory'; but the one resides in the freedom of the reader, and the other in the purposed domination of the author."

So my point here is that if you are making a module with this as an agenda (in other words making the story allegorical) then it's going to ring false. Applicability, however, tends to ring true in every age (people now make comparisons to Peter Jackson's LOTR and the war on terrorism... stupid gits) but when you aim for an idea rather than an agenda, you are more likely to hit your mark with your readers.

 

[Belen]

A good example of a game with an agenda would be Blue Rose, from Green Ronin, which I assume must have the same agenda as the fiction it's based on - pro-environmentalism, pro-feminism, pro-diversity, anti-Christian.

And very strongly pro-pony.

Not sure where you're getting anti-Christian from. The material the game is based upon is certainly not in that vein.

 

[Belen]

I play RPGs to get away from the real world for a few hours. I probably would not enjoy a game that had a strong agenda or bias. I want a good story, not preachy/soapbox hour. My games tend to incorporate universal truths such as good versus evil where evil is an evil that any sane person would agree is evil.

And, in many cases, if the game has an agenda, it means the GM feels that he needs to get the agenda out because not all his PLAYERS agree with him on the subject. If everyone agrees with you, then there is no reason to have an agenda in game.

If you're talking about a published game that had an agenda, then I would not buy it.

If you're talking about Blue Rose, then I disagree. I see the game and its source material as an idolized version of the USA. If that game has an agenda at all, then it is to espouse equality, true equality among all.

Also strong women are sexy.

 

[francisca]

I don't like games or anything else for that matter that are little more than thinly veiled political or social activism And that goes for whether I agree with the view or not. I don't like people shoving their concerns down my throat, and often this stuff gets patronizingly preachy. I find patronizing tones to be fairly offensive.

What he said. I find social engineering, subtle or blatant, to be repugnant in all forms, even when pushing an agenda I otherwise agree with.

 

[pdkoning]

I play RPGs to get away from the real world for a few hours. I probably would not enjoy a game that had a strong agenda or bias. I want a good story, not preachy/soapbox hour. My games tend to incorporate universal truths such as good versus evil where evil is an evil that any sane person would agree is evil.
....(snip)

Herein lies one of the problems, you talk about univeral truths, but for some people 'your truth' is not 'their truth'. Even if any sane person agrees on you point of view, there might be others who think otherwise. About games with an agenda: most games do have an implict or explicit agenda, as mentioned in this thread before: promoting good heroic deeds, killing evil beings and taking their stuff.
I would accept any agenda in a game or setting as long as it does not obviously oppose my own ideas and ideals, and the game is fun and of a certain quality.

 

[Hand of Evil]

You know me, define it! It being your campaign settng, your house rules, your views of good and evil, is this an agenda, yes. You set the parameters and the players play within that structure.

 

[Henry]

Games that have an "Agenda-premise" can and do sell well, if handled appropriately. As S'mon pointed out, all authors have their point of view infused in their work to an extent. If it's a "HIT YOU OVER THE HEAD" lesson, as in some rather unnameable games that have already been named earlier in the thread, then you're not only limiting your audience, you're preaching, and the only ones listening are the converted. OTOH, some games have a concept as an undertone, and still remember to be fun to play. Troy Denning (Or was it Doug Niles) said that in their Dark Sun work they infused some of the premise with their own beliefs on ecological conservation; it resulted in a pretty innovative campaign setting with a small but dedicated fan base.

 

[Desdichado]

Crothian, is this thread entirely serious?

I don't mind an agenda, unless I disagree with it, naturally. I was a bit miffed about Werewolf: The Apocalypse, for instance, when I went through all the tribebooks. The druggy-hippy-New Age paganism amalgam that was the Children of Gaia were so obviously painted by the authors as the "best" tribe who had it all goin' on that I was pretty put off.

Of course, if your agenda is the promotion of ooze-rights, then what-the-heck, there's no such thing in real life, so it's not likely to push any buttons one way or another.