Is starting depth of campaign crucial to player retention?

[Emirikol]

Is starting depth of campaign crucial to player retention?

Example a: Game set in a homebrew or published world. Players are provided with lots of background material to work with and given ways for their characters to "fit into the world." Each of the races are given additional background relevant to the world.

Example b: DM has players make characters from the PHB with no character backgrounds, and no campaign background. They are told they are in a "town" or "keep" to start and will set out from there.

Is having a world setting crucial to campaign survival?

jh

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

No...

sometimes having a blank slate that is 'built' by the players adventures works best...

really depends on the players

 

[Philotomy Jurament]

No, not at all, IMO.

 

[SiderisAnon]

It Can Matter To Player Addition

I have not found that having a detailed campaign world laid out particularly helps with character retention. I've run both with and without such material, and there seems little difference in my numbers.

However, I have found that a detailed campaign world helps with getting players in the first place. I tend to look for higher caliber players when I am starting up a new campaign and we're short people. These kinds of players tend to respond well to my being able to send them a huge set of campaign material for them to read and get excited about.

 

[Elf Witch]

For me a campaign with no detailed background is not one I am intrested in. It says to me that the DM either does not realize this is important or that he does not have the time to really work on the game.

When I was new to gaming and would jump at any chance to play I played in some of these games and they never improved. They were bland games where we went from dungeon crawl to wildnerness encounter killing things and taking their stuff. I noticed that most of the players did not even know the other players PCs names and sometimes could not even remember theirs.

Yet when I played with some of these same players in a more detailed game this was not the case.

I did notice that I tended to drop out of those type of games fairly quickly.

 

[Emirikol]

For me a campaign with no detailed background is not one I am intrested in. It says to me that the DM either does not realize this is important or that he does not have the time to really work on the game. .

I'm with you. I don't like this idea of starting a campaign without background.

I've never seen a campaign world successfully created by the players though...how does that work?

jh

 

[Woas]

I've found through experience a detailed world is mostly just wasted work. So now a days I'm in that club that "lets the players make the world/game."

Not that prep in general for a game is wasteful though. I'd never DM a game without first getting a couple pages of names for person, places and things. But a full on discourse of cultures, history, maps, etc.? No way.

And Emirikol, do you want an explanation of player made games here or start a new thread?

 

[Captain Tagon]

Depends on what kind of gaming I want out of it. In-depth roleplay, I'd probably prefer something more defined. Beer and pretzels gaming, a skeleton of a setting is all you need.

Though I do love player created content. Prime Time Adventures and Mortal Coil both showed me how hashing out a setting as a group can make you much more invested in a setting. Works for me at least.

 

[Emirikol]

I've found through experience a detailed world is mostly just wasted work. So now a days I'm in that club that "lets the players make the world/game." ot that prep in general for a game is wasteful though. I'd never DM a game without first getting a couple pages of names for person, places and things. But a full on discourse of cultures, history, maps, etc.? No way.

And Emirikol, do you want an explanation of player made games here or start a new thread?

I agree on the "wasted work." I've been there/done that too many times with homebrew stuff. That's why I prefer working with a pre-published world of some kind. Whether it be a book from fiction authors (like Conan) or Greyhawk, I like that all the work is pretty much done and then if I do any work, it can be at my own leisure.

As for "player made games" it was nice of you to ask. I think it would be relevant for a new thread or here is ok too.

jh

 

[Woas]

I guess I can just put it here then if its no matter.

Basically the idea to player made games is just thinking about the game on the other side of the fence so to speak.
Just from my own experience with pen&paper RPGs; when I started to game and put on the DM hat, all the D&D books I had (DMG, PHB and just advice from websites and elsewhere in general) gave me the impression that it was my job to do most of the work. There was some unwritten law (in my mind) that the game "belonged" to the DM and the players were there to enjoy it... and subsequently mess it all up!
So just turn that around. What came first the chicken/DM or the egg/players? What if the players, or just some of them even have a great idea for a game and ask someone else to DM it for them? This sort of stems from the mindset of calling a DM a referee. In reality a "player" made game can have as much detail as a "DM" made game though. It boils down to a mind-set and allowing the players to speak up and say, "this is what is fun to ME. Screw Conan or the Forgotten Realms or Eberron. I want to play ..... Please DM this for us." Its just getting straight to the what everyone wants out of a game and cutting off the baggage. And since the players are the ones doing it they are automatically getting themselves involved/invested in the game. And there are plenty of games out there that make this a core of the game. Along with what Captain Tagon mentioned I'd add Burning Wheel and Ars Magica as two great player-driven games if the idea interested you.

But thats it in a nut shell. I guess after now writing it out and reading your response above this time of game play does not specifically correlate to depth of campaigns since players may easily say, "Hey, we want a Conan game!" and there ya go.