Is there a D20 Dark Ages book available?

[Sebastian Francis]

You're not telling me anything new. All I said was "I guess it depends on what your vision of the Dark Ages really is. To a lot of people, D&D already is d20 Dark Ages." You didn't say anything about that really.

Yeah, but he got to make a long post about what the "Dark Ages" really is and tried to look smart in the process.

 

[Desdichado]

Well part of that is the imprecision of the terms. Technically the "Middle Ages" include the "Dark Ages", although it also includes periods subsequent to the Dark Ages. The ages also don't correspond wholely across really broad geographical regions; there's a good case to be made for the conquest of William the Conqueror being the end of an era in England and the beginning of a new one, but it had no real affect on Germany, Italy, the Byzantine Empire (or what was left of it) or the developing Slavic states, for example.

For what it's worth, I certainly wouldn't consider D&D to be a good Dark Ages analog.

Hey, A2Z, have you ever looked at Pendragon? It's got two setting included; a quasi-mythical, Malloryesque version of King Arthur, and the quasi-historical Dark Ages Romanized Britons and Saxons as the second setting. I know you're looking for a broader geographic distribution than that, but I honestly can't think of a source that covers all of Europe well, much less the Near East, Central Asia, etc. Eastern Europe was more influenced, in most respects, by Central Asia throughout the Middle Ages; early or otherwise, than it was by Western Europe, in most respects.

 

[Wombat]

Heck in academia there is no such thing as The Dark Ages anymore.

You go from Classical to Late Antiquity to Early Medieval, with the transitions being as vague as the differences between Late Middle Ages and Renaissance (depends on where you are, historically, and who you are talking to, professorially).

 

[Galethorn]

Yeah, but he got to make a long post about what the "Dark Ages" really is and tried to look smart in the process.

I wasn't trying to look smart; I had something to say about the topic, which I've said many times now, and needs no more repetition. I used various bits of information to support it, and may have (in the process) camoflaged the ultimate point of my first post. However, I think I made it clear in my second post on the matter. If not, I'll spell it out again; the idea of D&D as the ruleset (or any of the settings like FR or Greyhawk as the setting) for dark-age-style adventures/campaigns (without heavy houseruling) is abhorrent to me; the difference between D&D/FR and the dark ages is like the difference between D&D/FR and the 17th century.

Now in response to the spirit of your message; some people might say you were trying to look cool by saying that I was trying to look smart. I assure you, however, that I still assume you didn't mean to be condescending so much as sarcastic, and I'm a firm believer in sarcasm...so, I won't take you comment as a slight...not that it would mean much, if anything, to you if I did, this being the internet and all...

Oh well, I'll pretend you never said anything about me if you pretend I didn't muck up this thread with my long posts...

 

[Sebastian Francis]

Now in response to the spirit of your message; some people might say you were trying to look cool by saying that I was trying to look smart. I assure you, however, that I still assume you didn't mean to be condescending so much as sarcastic, and I'm a firm believer in sarcasm...so, I won't take you comment as a slight...not that it would mean much, if anything, to you if I did, this being the internet and all...

I wasn't trying to be condescending or even sarcastic. I was just trying, unsuccessfully, to be funny. :\ Should have added a smiley, though. Sorry for the confusion.

Just for the record, I actually found your post about the Dark Ages to be quite interesting...

Later!

 

[JPL]

Nerd fight! NERD FIGHT!!!

The old 2.0 Celts book might be a bit early for your purposes, I guess. I sure liked that one, back in high school...

 

[Galethorn]

I wasn't trying to be condescending or even sarcastic. I was just trying, unsuccessfully, to be funny. :\ Should have added a smiley, though. Sorry for the confusion.

Just for the record, I actually found your post about the Dark Ages to be quite interesting...

Later!

Ohhhhh, I understand. Good to hear that my post was interesting...


Anyway, back to the topic; is there any Dark Ages book of any kind for d20? I don't know, but I might have enough OGL material together for my new setting to use as a sort of 'flavor pack' that could be adapted for real europe rather than my made-up continent, Theudlund. Or not. I'm pretty lazy, and I'm having enough trouble getting the gumption necessary to put stuff together just for my group...

 

[fusangite]

One of the big problems with doing a game supplement about the early medieval period is that the European experience was much more diverse in this period than in the much more popular high medieval period.

I started on this project myself, producing a 9th century Europe D20 game. Now the project is confined to 9th century Dalmatia.

I'm eager to see how this thread turns out -- I'd love to see a supplement like the one you describe but fear it would be pretty lengthy.

 

[Desdichado]

Avalanche produced a fair amount of 3e compliant sourcebooks that would have covered areas of Europe during the "Dark Ages" including a book on Constantinople and one on Vikings.

A2Z, what particularly are you interested in about the "Dark Ages" anyway? Vikings and Anglo-Saxon kingdoms? Celtic quasi-historical King Arthur type stories? The Byzantine Empire? Or just a general kinda quasi-early Medieval feel? I think the answer is coming out fairly clearly that there's not one source that will give you what you want, but maybe if we knew more specifically what you wanted we could hone in on some more detailed sources.

 

[A2Z]

Avalanche produced a fair amount of 3e compliant sourcebooks that would have covered areas of Europe during the "Dark Ages" including a book on Constantinople and one on Vikings.

A2Z, what particularly are you interested in about the "Dark Ages" anyway? Vikings and Anglo-Saxon kingdoms? Celtic quasi-historical King Arthur type stories? The Byzantine Empire? Or just a general kinda quasi-early Medieval feel? I think the answer is coming out fairly clearly that there's not one source that will give you what you want, but maybe if we knew more specifically what you wanted we could hone in on some more detailed sources.

What renewed my interest in running a historical earth campaign was the Red Sails article from Dragon a couple years back. It covered Eastern Europe during that time period for thise who don't remember it. So, I suppose those areas would be the main focus, although I have an idea that would probably bring the party to Scandinavia and another that would bring them to The Holy Roman Empire (or its remains depending on what year I set it in).

Here's a map of the area I'd probably keep the campaign in. So, I suppose I'm looking for anything that gives me info on the people and places of those areas.