Is this "Fair" - Part III

[Brian Gibbons]

So, if the DM says, with your limited resources and lack of contacts, you were not able to uncover any information - that is a clue to me to leave this puppy alone until another time.

It's all about the social contract.

I can easily imagine a campaign where the GM would set out this scenario, not allow research to work (because it gives him more scope for surprises) and then get very frustrated at the players for not playing along. "Hey, I gave you the plot hook to the adventure. If you didn't want to adventure, why did you show up to play?"

 

[mcrow]

I'd say it is fair.

Like "is this fair" part II, not every adventure seed the PC come across should be followed up on. If they don't do the research and just go running in, it is their own fault.

 

[Someone]

I voted "other". I don´t know if it´s fair or unfair, but sure it´s bad DMing. The map serves no other purpose but to kill the PCs; it doesn´t advance the history, provide any clue, or do anything remotely constructive except to inflate the DM´s ego for beings able to kills a bunch of 1st level characters. In a campaing such as this, my character would stay in his farm, "winning" as his companions die once and again at the hands of unpredictable dangers.

 

[mcrow]

I voted "other". I don´t know if it´s fair or unfair, but sure it´s bad DMing.

I don't know, about that.

Getting a Map in treasure of a location that is " filled with great treasures" is alway a clue that something is there. No one just leaves a bunch of treasure laying around unattended for no good reason.

In the real world if someone walked up to you and said: " you know that abandon castle there? It's full of money, all you have to do is go get it." wouldn't you be bit curious as to why so much money is just laying around and no one grabbed it.


If they just go walking upto it and didn't ask around or research it and TPK is the result, then I call that bad playing on the PCs part.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

The first version is close enough to fair. The PCs can be required to make some reasonable efforts at protecting their skins.

The second version is just crappy, lazy DMing.

 

[the Jester]

Again, fair.

Rushing in blind is just plain foolish for adventurers.

 

[the Jester]

I voted "other". I don´t know if it´s fair or unfair, but sure it´s bad DMing. The map serves no other purpose but to kill the PCs; it doesn´t advance the history, provide any clue, or do anything remotely constructive except to inflate the DM´s ego for beings able to kills a bunch of 1st level characters.

Or, perhaps, sew the seeds of later adventures...?

Do you think that dropping plot hooks about high-level adventures should wait for the pcs to be high-level? Because, especially when you get to epic levels, you almost have to have dropped clues many games ago to lay the groundwork for the challenges the pcs will be facing. Unless you want the diablo-style, "everything is automatically a challenge for you at your level wherever you go and whatever you do" type of game- fine for some folks, but my group likes things a little different.

I guess it's all about play style, eh?

 

[mcrow]

Or, perhaps, sew the seeds of later adventures...?

Do you think that dropping plot hooks about high-level adventures should wait for the pcs to be high-level? Because, especially when you get to epic levels, you almost have to have dropped clues many games ago to lay the groundwork for the challenges the pcs will be facing. Unless you want the diablo-style, "everything is automatically a challenge for you at your level wherever you go and whatever you do" type of game- fine for some folks, but my group likes things a little different.

I guess it's all about play style, eh?

exactly my thought. If every seed is a perfect match for your party (i.e. unlikely that they would be killed no matter what they do) then the game is no fun for me. If there is no danger, there is no suspsense, and no fun.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

Or, perhaps, sew the seeds of later adventures...?

Crappy DMing nonetheless.

It is completely legitimate to drop hints about a longer term campaign goal/hook that is intended for later but too much for the PCs now. I cannot imagine doing a worse job at it than this example. Even if it were not more than a bit dumb, it is boring to play out.

Plot seeds for later can easily be accomplished with mere rumors. If the DM is giving out much much more than rumors right now, it should be for a reason that makes the game more fun.

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

I think what I am becoming to realize after reading a bunch of these threads is that there are many people that do not believe that there should be challenges in the gaming world that are not level appropriate.

In my campaign world there are things that low level PC's hear about that would be instant death if they followed up on them, IMHO there will be times that a PC will not have the appropriate skill levels to investigate something, or open a lock, or find a trap, ...etc.

Spot on.