Just Read Sword of Shannara...

[CCamfield]

I seem to recall a parallel between Gollum and Garret Jax as well - both being somewhat untrustworthy characters who guide them into(?) the Place of Evil.

 

[Piratecat]

Hey, how come you didn't answer my post? I was looking forward to your response.

Because to answer it intelligently, I would have to read Sword of Shannara again, and I gave my copy away.

Allanon seemed to have covered it fairly completely. I seem to remember something with eagles, too, but that just might be my imagination.

 

[Assenpfeffer]

That's a bit of a stretch--lots of books have one or more of those. Dragonlance, The Belgaraid, and Death's Gate are a few examples where one or more of the above statements occur.

All of which are also derivative to one extent or another, and all of which are dismissed out of hand by many "serious fans" of fantasy.

In Sword of Shannara's case (and I'm reaching a long way back here - it's been around 18 years since I've read it,) I think there's a pretty close plot point by plot point parallel with LotR as well.

Personally, I liked it, but I was about 13 when I read it (before I'd read LotR,) so I have no illusions about it.

 

[takyris]

I am troubled to see that so many people who have read the books are stumbling over such obvious fallacies of critical interpretation. Saying that Shannara was inspired by LotR overlooks so many critical observations that it is obvious that anyone making such an observation has deep personal flaws.

For you see, "Sword of Shannara" was Science Fiction, not fantasy. I am shocked that so many supposed readers have failed to point out that Brooks' world was the result of a post-apocalyptic rebuilding, in which men mutated into dwarves, gnomes, and other creatures. Druidic magic and the powers of the evil monsters can all be attributed to the expansion of telepathic ability, the existence of symbiotic nano-organisms, and the use of enormous hidden server forms and excellent wireless ports. It has been some time since I read the original work, but my understanding was that the evil villain was restricted to his dark mountain fortress because that was the only area in which he got 'net, and our hero uses the Sword of Shannara to disrupt his connection through a denial of service attack (spamming the villain with "You are evil" messages until the server crashed).

My doctoral dissertation will serve as conclusive evidence that Sword of Shannara is not only science fiction, but HARD science fiction, rigorously applied, and that it actually draws from Riddley Walker more than from Lord of the Rings, even when one takes into account the fact that Riddley Walker was not published until several years after the first Shannara book.

 

[kingpaul]

For you see, "Sword of Shannara" was Science Fiction, not fantasy. I am shocked that so many supposed readers have failed to point out that Brooks' world was the result of a post-apocalyptic rebuilding, in which men mutated into dwarves, gnomes, and other creatures.

I do remember that it was a rebuilding, and the once-druid (can't recall his name, Boh, wasn't it?) also followed the 'old ways' of science and technology. However, just because it was built on a post-apocalypse world doesn't mean that it wasn't a fantasy novel.

Druidic magic and the powers of the evil monsters can all be attributed to the expansion of telepathic ability, the existence of symbiotic nano-organisms, and the use of enormous hidden server forms and excellent wireless ports. It has been some time since I read the original work, but my understanding was that the evil villain was restricted to his dark mountain fortress because that was the only area in which he got 'net, and our hero uses the Sword of Shannara to disrupt his connection through a denial of service attack (spamming the villain with "You are evil" messages until the server crashed).

? I really don't recall that kind of talk in the books. Computers and wireless connections?

My doctoral dissertation will serve as conclusive evidence that Sword of Shannara is not only science fiction, but HARD science fiction, rigorously applied, and that it actually draws from Riddley Walker more than from Lord of the Rings, even when one takes into account the fact that Riddley Walker was not published until several years after the first Shannara book.

What's the title of your dissertation?

 

[GoodKingJayIII]

Saying that Shannara was inspired by LotR overlooks so many critical observations that it is obvious that anyone making such an observation has deep personal flaws.

Sorry, but I tend not to differentiate science fiction and fantasy too much. There are things that identify and seperate the two, but the genres bare enough similarities, in my eyes, that they complement each other.

So forgive me if I don't find that to be a "deep personal flaw," and I'll thank you not to insult personal integrity anymore, whether that be mine or someone else's. Comparing LotR and Shannara is just as valid as your comparison. One might even argue that Brooks's world is actually the 5th Age.

 

[AFGNCAAP]

I am troubled to see that so many people who have read the books are stumbling over such obvious fallacies of critical interpretation. Saying that Shannara was inspired by LotR overlooks so many critical observations that it is obvious that anyone making such an observation has deep personal flaws.

For you see, "Sword of Shannara" was Science Fiction, not fantasy. I am shocked that so many supposed readers have failed to point out that Brooks' world was the result of a post-apocalyptic rebuilding, in which men mutated into dwarves, gnomes, and other creatures. Druidic magic and the powers of the evil monsters can all be attributed to the expansion of telepathic ability, the existence of symbiotic nano-organisms, and the use of enormous hidden server forms and excellent wireless ports. It has been some time since I read the original work, but my understanding was that the evil villain was restricted to his dark mountain fortress because that was the only area in which he got 'net, and our hero uses the Sword of Shannara to disrupt his connection through a denial of service attack (spamming the villain with "You are evil" messages until the server crashed).

My doctoral dissertation will serve as conclusive evidence that Sword of Shannara is not only science fiction, but HARD science fiction, rigorously applied, and that it actually draws from Riddley Walker more than from Lord of the Rings, even when one takes into account the fact that Riddley Walker was not published until several years after the first Shannara book.

So, in essence, Sword of Shannara is effectively a merger (conceptually) between Tolkien's Lord of the Rings and Vance's Dying Earth, albeit the backstory/"fluff" for "why" has been transmuted from a fantastic to a sci-fi one?

 

[takyris]

However, just because it was built on a post-apocalypse world doesn't mean that it wasn't a fantasy novel.

So despite the fact that Shannara is so clearly closer to Asimov's Foundation series, Vinge's Fire Upon the Deep, and several minor sub-plots from the Honor Harrington books, you insist on seeing only the surface-level similarities that could, to the untrained eye, bespeak some form of similarity?

I really don't recall that kind of talk in the books. Computers and wireless connections?

I don't have the book with me, but it's all there, if you're willing to look at the metaphorical subtext. Brooks was writing well ahead of his time, and his super-scientific druidic magic actually predicted cell phones, wireless ethernet, and the concept of the prepaid phone card (metaphorically represented through the elfstones, which appear to be mere trinkets but contain ultimate power provided that the user possesses the self-knowledge, or personal identification number, necessary to unlock the power imbued into it in the form of minutes).

What's the title of your dissertation?

Lord of the Token Ring: An Examination of Druidic Magic as a Naturalistic Interpretation of Superscience in Hard Science Fiction

I'll thank you not to insult personal integrity anymore, whether that be mine or someone else's. Comparing LotR and Shannara is just as valid as your comparison. One might even argue that Brooks's world is actually the 5th Age.

GoodKingJay, I'm sorry that you feel threatened by my post, but it obviously illustrates that you're not a very careful reader. Honestly, ask yourself: Did you even notice that The Belgariad is a gods-substituted-for-computer-programs retelling of TRON?

 

[takyris]

So, in essence, Sword of Shannara is effectively a merger (conceptually) between Tolkien's Lord of the Rings and Vance's Dying Earth, albeit the backstory/"fluff" for "why" has been transmuted from a fantastic to a sci-fi one?

Wait, AFGNCAAP, did you do your doctoral dissertation on this, too? I think I might actually be using your dissertation in my bibliography! It's good to see that some people here are capable of examining the deep bovi-excremental themes imprinted into works that the ordinary "surface-level" readers think of as epic fantasy.

 

[kingpaul]

It's good to see that some people here are capable of examining the deep bovi-excremental themes imprinted into works that the ordinary "surface-level" readers think of as epic fantasy.

*snort* You can find deep meaning in anything if you dig deep enough. Just because some people don't dig as deep as you do doesn't mean that gives you the right to imply their method of enjoymenet is any less worthy than yours.