Konsequences - Kobold style

[LostSoul]

Look, if the rules of the universe state that horrible deeds of evil and slaughter can lead to power-ups, then you should expect the PCs to act accordingly.

Also, see similar statements about consequences being meaningless in a world without rules.

I thought that's what D&D was about - horrible deeds of slaughter (maybe or maybe not evil) leading directly to power-ups!

I understand the argument about consequences, but I'm coming from the point of view that Mike knows his players best, and is doing what will be best for his group.

 

[thundershot]

Sorry to interrupt, but I think this whole concept is awesome, and I might be stealing some tidbits of it for my own campaign (which just started this week). Thanks, Michael!



Chris

 

[Allegro]

I’m don’t like the town turning against the hero so easily. If you truly want the town to turn against the PCs runs something like this. PCs are wakened in the inn by somebody throwing stones at the window. When they investigate out the window they see the door to the neighboring house wide open with a broken chair in plain view. When the PCs get to the house they see the house has been brutally ransacked but a baby is crying somewhere inside the house diabolical laughter is heard. The kobolds sets a trap on one of the doors which spills blood on the PCs if they trigger it. The kobold inside is signaled and climbs down from the second floor. Perhaps the PCs see the escaping kobold so they know the truth. When the PCs reach the top floor of the house, the town’s bell starts ringing. What will the PCs do when confronted by the Sheriff covered in blood?



I'd recommend having the PCs being hero's given the latitude to investigate the crime and perhaps find a witness who saw the entire thing. Perhaps a halfling guttersnipe who is down on his luck and is known to thieve pies. The group perhaps could find foot prints somewhere in town.

 

[Michael Morris]

I find it amusing to that some in this thread interpret a pair of kobolds being able to infiltrate the outskirts of a settlement and kill a baby as some sign of the town being unable to defend itself. Mass histeria folks - as well policed and defended as my home town of Knoxville is in real life that didn't stop one determined loon from opening fire with a shotgun in a church a week ago.

Small criminal groups and deranged individuals can do nasty things to communities even if they cannot hope to outright overthrow the status quo or ruling order. City walls stop the invasion of armies, but a pair of kobolds - not so much. Will they succeed? The first time sure - the party won't be watching for it. Will the party get kicked out? Depends on how they handle themselves when brought up for questioning. Will the party be able to stop the little beasts from doing it repeatedly? I don't know - but they certainly should be given the opportunity to.

What I plan out before the session is very different from what I do because I listen and react to the group.

As to the ability of two kobolds to pull this off - that's not indicative of a defenseless township by a long shot and to characterize it as such is to demonstrate ignorance of the long history of criminal justice.

 

[Filcher]

Small criminal groups and deranged individuals can do nasty things to communities even if they cannot hope to outright overthrow the status quo or ruling order. City walls stop the invasion of armies, but a pair of kobolds - not so much. Will they succeed? The first time sure - the party won't be watching for it. Will the party get kicked out? Depends on how they handle themselves when brought up for questioning. Will the party be able to stop the little beasts from doing it repeatedly? I don't know - but they certainly should be given the opportunity to.

Agreed.

Give the kobolds box cutters and an airline ticket and they will bring down the U.S.

 

[thundershot]

Agreed.

Give the kobolds box cutters and an airline ticket and they will bring down the U.S.

*spits out drink!*


You've been quoted.



Chris

 

[robertliguori]

I find it amusing to that some in this thread interpret a pair of kobolds being able to infiltrate the outskirts of a settlement and kill a baby as some sign of the town being unable to defend itself. Mass histeria folks - as well policed and defended as my home town of Knoxville is in real life that didn't stop one determined loon from opening fire with a shotgun in a church a week ago.

Small criminal groups and deranged individuals can do nasty things to communities even if they cannot hope to outright overthrow the status quo or ruling order. City walls stop the invasion of armies, but a pair of kobolds - not so much. Will they succeed? The first time sure - the party won't be watching for it. Will the party get kicked out? Depends on how they handle themselves when brought up for questioning. Will the party be able to stop the little beasts from doing it repeatedly? I don't know - but they certainly should be given the opportunity to.

What I plan out before the session is very different from what I do because I listen and react to the group.

As to the ability of two kobolds to pull this off - that's not indicative of a defenseless township by a long shot and to characterize it as such is to demonstrate ignorance of the long history of criminal justice.

Criminal justice is the wrong metaphor. We do not live adjacent to a hostile species in direct and murderous competition with us for land, resources, and the like, whom we mutually kill on sight. If we did, interactions with that species would be a military matter, not a civil matter.

Basically, if there are kobolds, and if the expected interaction of humans and kobolds isn't the nice, polite raiding or even the murder-and-loot but total genocide, then the mere presence of the original kobold colony was a sign of a threat.

 

[Scribble]

I really like this idea.

As for townsfolk too easily turning on them?

Fear is a huge motivating force. No one wants to think about their baby being burned on a stake by Kobolds, no matter how small the chance might be. If the kobolds indicate: Turn on the heros or we will burn more babies- there will be pleanty of people ready to turn on the heros no matter how illogical it might be.

For an example that works well:

Spoiler

Anyone see The Dark Knight? Look how quickly they turned on batman?

 

[Kraydak]

I find it amusing to that some in this thread interpret a pair of kobolds being able to infiltrate the outskirts of a settlement and kill a baby as some sign of the town being unable to defend itself. Mass histeria folks - as well policed and defended as my home town of Knoxville is in real life that didn't stop one determined loon from opening fire with a shotgun in a church a week ago.

Small criminal groups and deranged individuals can do nasty things to communities even if they cannot hope to outright overthrow the status quo or ruling order. City walls stop the invasion of armies, but a pair of kobolds - not so much. Will they succeed? The first time sure - the party won't be watching for it. Will the party get kicked out? Depends on how they handle themselves when brought up for questioning. Will the party be able to stop the little beasts from doing it repeatedly? I don't know - but they certainly should be given the opportunity to.

What I plan out before the session is very different from what I do because I listen and react to the group.

As to the ability of two kobolds to pull this off - that's not indicative of a defenseless township by a long shot and to characterize it as such is to demonstrate ignorance of the long history of criminal justice.

Infiltrating a walled town in the middle of a somewhat hostile wilderness >> walking into a church that prides itself on welcoming everyone. Infiltrating a town whose (somewhat xenophobic) population you do not look even remotely like is harder than infiltrating a church filled with members of your own race. Doing this, and then launching attacks without drawing any attention is also very hard.

The kobold's plan isn't impossible in the abstract (it is, perhaps, overly devious and might require knowledge the kobolds don't have), but it is almost certainly beyond their capacities. If they were lvl 10+, well, things might be different. If they reduce their plan to terrorizing outlying farms (which, themselves, are probably well defended if the world is to be self consistent), then things might work out for them (I would still expect a farm to be able to fight them off, a couple of guard dogs+a non-minion farmer or two is a minimal defense force).

 

[LostSoul]

The kobold's plan isn't impossible in the abstract (it is, perhaps, overly devious and might require knowledge the kobolds don't have), but it is almost certainly beyond their capacities. If they were lvl 10+, well, things might be different.

Have you seen their Stealth checks? With a little bonus (for night, let's say), they can Take 10 and get a 21. Not bad!

I don't think it should take a skill mod of +15 or so to sneak into a sleepy little village.