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<blockquote data-quote="Sacrosanct" data-source="post: 6346077" data-attributes="member: 15700">That would be the bard, or any class with a persuasion skill <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink&nbsp; &nbsp; ;)"&nbsp; data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />Seriously though, I see your overall point.&nbsp; And I think we need to ask ourselves at what point do we need a subclass vs being able to accomplish what we want with the rules in place.&nbsp; AD&amp;D had a ton of classes that kept coming out.&nbsp; Every DRAGON magazine.&nbsp; Sure, they were &quot;NPC&quot; classes, but everyone knew players used them as PC classes.&nbsp; Bandit, archer, revised monk, ninja, duelist, death master, and even neaderthal.&nbsp; That's because AD&amp;D wasn't set up to customize your PC very well for many of the archetypes.&nbsp; You had to multi-class and hope you got close (and had to be a demi-human), or try to create your own class with the rules in DMG which weren't very user friendly.5e, by contrast, is very easy to customize your PC into nearly every archetype you want with the implementation of backgrounds and feats.&nbsp; I for one don't want to have huge page bloat or splat bloat for subclasses for everything if you can essentially recreate the same thing using a bit of creativity with the tools already given.&nbsp; Do we need an assassin fighter class, or can that be done with taking a criminal background to get the stealth skills and feats to complement it?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Sacrosanct, post: 6346077, member: 15700"] That would be the bard, or any class with a persuasion skill ;) Seriously though, I see your overall point. And I think we need to ask ourselves at what point do we need a subclass vs being able to accomplish what we want with the rules in place. AD&D had a ton of classes that kept coming out. Every DRAGON magazine. Sure, they were "NPC" classes, but everyone knew players used them as PC classes. Bandit, archer, revised monk, ninja, duelist, death master, and even neaderthal. That's because AD&D wasn't set up to customize your PC very well for many of the archetypes. You had to multi-class and hope you got close (and had to be a demi-human), or try to create your own class with the rules in DMG which weren't very user friendly. 5e, by contrast, is very easy to customize your PC into nearly every archetype you want with the implementation of backgrounds and feats. I for one don't want to have huge page bloat or splat bloat for subclasses for everything if you can essentially recreate the same thing using a bit of creativity with the tools already given. Do we need an assassin fighter class, or can that be done with taking a criminal background to get the stealth skills and feats to complement it? [/QUOTE]

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