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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 6112113" data-attributes="member: 42582">Agreed. I can see the argument that beginners need less complexity on the PC capabilities side, but if anything they need more hit points, not fewer!I tend to agree with this too.And I definitely agree with this.Assuming that hit dice are still proportionate to levels (and if they're not, that's even weirder, AD&D monks and rangers to one side), then these Apprentice levels are no good for newbies - because their PCs will die too often. But they're no good for the typical seasoned player either, who is advised to start at 3rd level, quite counterintuitively in my view for the reasons AbdulAlhazred has stated. So who exactly are they for? Those who want to replicate classic D&D 1st level meatgrinders, as AbdulAlhazed suggested upthread?There seem to be other, more elegant, ways of solving the newbie problem eg give the newbie a Fate Point or reroll ability in lieu of class features - which deals with the "we don't want newbies to have their PCs die on them problem", as well as the complexity problem - and then have rules for trading out your Fate Points for class abilities, which are separate from the levelling process and reflect the real world transition from newbie to experienced player who needs less Fate Point-style hand holding and can handle a more complex character.And if someone never wants to make that transition, that's fine too - you balance the reroll/Fate Point rules against class abilities all the way to 10th level, say, or even 20th if you're really ambitious!Also, on an only marginally related note, there is just no way you can model Ged, from A Wizard of Earthsea, as a 1st level wizard or sorcerer, except perhaps in 4e (and even then I've got grave doubts). In his first "adventure" he summons an Obscuring Mist that covers a whole village. He can call and command animals. And in his first real adventure - against the dragon - he defeats mutlipel dragonlings by himself using a Hold Monster-style binding of their wings (the reason I mention 4e is because the dragonlings can be statted as minions, but you're a long way out of Monster Manual territoriy if you have low level dragon minions!).</blockquote>

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