Lesser Geas

[reapersaurus]

oh come on, you CAN'T be serious.
It is quite obvious what the designer's intent is with the Geas/Quest spell.
It is a no-save, compulsion spell. Hell, it's 6th level - what's worse, having 4 hp's left (Harm) or being forced to go on a Quest?

You cannot choose to ignore it, and any attempt at using the bad choice of wording to describe that the effect is obviously just like Lesser Geas, just with no save is simply someone trying to monkey around with the rules for their own benefit.

 

[Hypersmurf]

You cannot choose to ignore it, and any attempt at using the bad choice of wording to describe that the effect is obviously just like Lesser Geas, just with no save is simply someone trying to monkey around with the rules for their own benefit.

Hang on, what? I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

By the wording, you can't ignore Lesser Geas.

Because of ambiguous wording, it unclear as to whether or not you can ignore Geas.

As near as I can tell, you're saying that you shouldn't be able to ignore Geas, but you're also saying that people who think it's like Lesser Geas (ie, can't be ignored) are monkeying with rules.

I'm lost

-Hyp.

 

[Lord Ben]

Sorry to drudge up that can of worms. It seems fairly straight forward to me, you must follow that course of actions. Not just elect to ignore it and do something else instead. If you cast it on the Cleric and say "Refrain from casting spells" they MUST stop casting for x days/level" They can't just decide to ignore it and cure themselves.

 

[reapersaurus]

Hyp - substitute "isn't" for "is" in my sentence....
as in "if anyone suggests that Geas isn't just like Lesser Geas, they are just trying to monkey with language to gain something clearly against the intent of the designers.

 

[LokiDR]

I disagree with spells that will cause lasting damage to party cohesion. I have seen Geas do that. What would a person in combat compel a person to do? Kill another party member. That command lasts well beyond the combat, and can be a very sticky point. What about the command "leave". Also a good command, but it splits the party.

Death is temporary, your party is forever.

Please don't tell me that you just shouldn't issue these commands. Using spells badly just doesn't just to the challange the party should face and makes NPCs a joke rather than a force to be delt with in the game.

The primary reason I don't believe that you need to follow a course of actions for Geas is that Geas can kill you, Lesser Geas can't. If the party holds the Lesser Geassed person down, they won't die, and can be cured of the curse. If you choose to ignore Geas, you take your life into your hands. At least then you have some time to fix the problem.

I personally think they should both be "follow the command or else" but that is just me.

 

[Lord Ben]

So they destroy party cohesion? Big deal if it's short term and the party has the chance to sack the barbarian and tie him down.

I just want a way to make the fighter attack the mage without using dominate which would give two saves, one at a higher bonus due to attacking a friend. This seems like a good spell for that, or would suggestion be better?

 

[LokiDR]

So they destroy party cohesion? Big deal if it's short term and the party has the chance to sack the barbarian and tie him down.

I just want a way to make the fighter attack the mage without using dominate which would give two saves, one at a higher bonus due to attacking a friend. This seems like a good spell for that, or would suggestion be better?

There should be a way to make the barabian attack only last the combat. I don't know what level spell it is, but you could try Translocation Trick. I think it is out of FR. Else, you could try some fun image tricks, like the illusion of the bad guy over the party wizard and the image of the party wizard over the bay guy. That works on a whole party.

I dissagree that this a short term situation. If the wizard is smart, he will stay out of reach (levitate or fly). That means this could go on for days. That is only if the command is "hit the wizard". More likely, the caster would say "kill that wizard". How is that short term?

Have you ever tried to tie down a barbarian? If the player just lets the rest of party do it, I would call it metagaming. The rogue isn't going to rope him, most like. The cleric can't grapple him that well. Hell, even a fighter would have a hard time.

Then, unless your cleric has break enchantment or remove curse memorized that day, the barbarian is out untill the cleric can re-mem spells. That can be annoying for the barbarian. If you use a druid as the party healer, you are screwed unless you can get a limited wish.

Suggestion has a much shorter duration, and can have the same effect.

Don't get me wrong, I think lesser geas is a neat tatic to try. But if you use this more than once or twice, I think the party would get very annoyed. Just my $0.02

 

[Lord Ben]

Yeah, I wouldn't use it frequently.

They could just cast hold person on the barbarian and then knock him out and wait until the next day.

I reread suggestion and I guess that would work. I didn't realize it could make someone do something. I thought it was more of suggesting to them something was true.

 

[LokiDR]

Yeah, I wouldn't use it frequently.

They could just cast hold person on the barbarian and then knock him out and wait until the next day.

I reread suggestion and I guess that would work. I didn't realize it could make someone do something. I thought it was more of suggesting to them something was true.

Either way, suggestion works. Suggestion: The wizard is trying to kill you. A fighter-type would most likely deal with this in a straight-forward way: kill the wizard first. Even if the fighter-type just grapples, trips, ect, the suggestion caster doesn't have to worry about either opponent for a while.

Mmm, combat enchanters. There should be a PrC called strife-maker for all these nifty abilites.

 

[Lord Ben]

I was looking into Mind Bender from T&B for a PC I had, but it kind of sucked. I like the idea of a PC.

Maybe I'll create a minor drawback on an item. Influenced from LotR. Whenever the PC's start argueing the ring casts suggestion or whatnot on a few of them to encourage them to fight... it would work.