Pathfinder 1E Leveling and combat in Pathfinder

[Scott DeWar]

you asked about toughening up the monsters, perhapps using the 'fast zombie' template wiotll be to your likeing. A zombie has to eithr move or attack, but with fast zombie they have a full round action available to them. Big suprise to the party. there are others in the D20pfrpg, I think. look around a bit for some fun stuff.

 

[Skeld]

My group is currently playing Star Wars Saga without XP and it seems to work pretty well. It took some getting used on the players part because they missed knowing how far away they were from their next level. Now that they are level 13, I think they've gotten used to it. So much so that we'll probably drop XP in our next 2 campaigns (both will be Pathfinder, which makes eliminating XP much easier).

-Skeld

 

[Kaisoku]

So @IronWolf & @mowgil along with other DMs who "level at will" what do you do with penalties to XP such as spells, crafting and even death?

Patfinder removed "XP as a resource". You can't lose XP in Pathfinder anymore, whether on purpose by spending on items or spells, or through death, etc.

XP is completely separated from the rest of the game mechanics. You can literally just level the players whenever you want and be done with it.

I can understand the concept, even more so in an AP since level determines how they will do at each module. I almost went this route in my WotBS game, but then I realized that people liked getting XP at the end of the game along with the treasure. I just made sure they XP was enough to get them were they needed to be

I did go with this route with WotBS, and it worked out great. The modules say "the party should be around <this> level by this point", so I just made sure they had enough levels by then.

As DM, I used the XP per encounter to kind of figure out how quickly the players should be leveling, and how difficult the fight was going to be, etc. A tool for the DM to gauge things, sort of.

Handing out XP now (both as DM doing it, and as a player receiving it) feels... strange. Almost like the players being given a glimpse at the DM process behind the scenes. *shrug*
It's not a resource anymore, so it feels odd that I should have something written on my character sheet that really isn't going to be used as the player.

It took some getting used on the players part because they missed knowing how far away they were from their next level.

Yeah, I tended to give them small updates at the end of sessions, like "You guys are about half-way now to <level>" or "You are probably going to level up really soon", etc.

After a while, they didn't really need that anymore. It helps if there's a lot of "trust in the DM". I can see this being more of a problem with those players and DMs that are a little more adversarial. And society play, of course (which I think uses a completely different tracking system anyways.. like, points per adventure, etc).

 

[Kaisoku]

Regarding the conversion of previous editions (even 3.5) to Pathfinder, here's my experience:

The core rules in Pathfinder have changed. I was running a Pathfinder WotBS game, and ran into more than one situation where the players had abilities, stats and wealth for their level in Pathfinder, but then I was making them face the creatures of the encounters "converted to remain true to the AP".

The problem with this is there's a number of things that have changed about creatures in Pathfinder. For one, they don't normally advance creatures with Hit Dice, and instead like to apply templates. Second, there's a number of creatures that were changed to be done in a much simpler way (using templates) or had their CR changed to match their abilities.
Then, there were a number of creatures that were simply not converted (yet).

After having a bunch of encounters that didn't really fit well, I decided to drop the "cleave true to the AP" and built encounters around the Stats by CR chart, and Party level vs Encounter Level chart, as it's depicted in Pathfinder.
If the players are playing by Pathfinder rules, then I need to challenge them with Pathfinder rules.

If this meant advancing Ghast stats, or adding a couple extra creatures for an encounter, or writing up a Hieracosphinx's stats from scratch, using the CR chart to determine what it should have for the CR encounter it's supposed to be.. well, so be it.
It won't be the same gameplay experience that it would have in 3.5e.. but honestly, that went out the window when the players made Pathfinder characters.

The party ends up being properly challenged (no unexpected "too hard" or "too easy" encounters), and everyone has a good time.

A lot of work on my part as DM though...

 

[IronWolf]

you asked about toughening up the monsters, perhapps using the 'fast zombie' template wiotll be to your likeing. A zombie has to eithr move or attack, but with fast zombie they have a full round action available to them. Big suprise to the party. there are others in the D20pfrpg, I think. look around a bit for some fun stuff.

The templates can be fun! I recently used a fast, plague zombie in an adventure for added effect!

Yeah, I tended to give them small updates at the end of sessions, like "You guys are about half-way now to <level>" or "You are probably going to level up really soon", etc.

I don't mind revealing similar info to the players either if they are getting antsy for a level-up. It at least gives them an idea of where they stand in regards to level progression.

After a while, they didn't really need that anymore. It helps if there's a lot of "trust in the DM". I can see this being more of a problem with those players and DMs that are a little more adversarial.

Agreed. It might not work for all groups. I'm lucky and have a pretty experienced, trusting group who makes doing things this way quite easy.

And society play, of course (which I think uses a completely different tracking system anyways.. like, points per adventure, etc).

Correct, PFS gives 1XP per scenario played and you need 3XP to bump to the next level.

 

[Scott DeWar]

an idea?

if you need xp = to 'a' and there are 'b' number pof players, then multiply a time b. when you are close to that number for total gained, keeping track of it your self, you can level them early or later. if they have been bad at playing , wait a few more encounters