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<blockquote data-quote="Charlaquin" data-source="post: 7371442" data-attributes="member: 6779196"><p>Way to put words in my mouth, dude. I don’t pretend to know everything, nor do I ignore the advice of those who came before me. Just because I have a different perspective than you does not mean I am ignoring yours, or that I think mine is infallible. How about we leave the ad homenim aside and focus on the actual arguments being made.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Never said I find them “amusing.” There’s a lot to like in both classic D&D and AD&D, and I have only respect for the trail they blazed.</p><p></p><p></p><p>So, I’m other words, the added depth of AD&D was worth the added complexity for you. Depth is good. Complexity is bad. But depth always comes with some amount of complexity. The key is to get the most depth you can out of the least complexity you can.</p><p></p><p></p><p>5th Edition has 320 pages in the players handbook, not thousands. And while yes, 230 is a larger number than 230, that’s a poor indicator of complexity. What matters is what’s actually on those pages. Formatting and content play a big role.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Sorry, but in AD&D there are a dozen or so separate subsystems for resolving different tasks. If I want to know if my character succeeds at bending the bars of a prison door, there’s a specific dice roll and table for that. If I want to pick the lock there’s a separate system for that. If I want to break the lock by hitting it with a weapon there’s a separate system for that. In any edition from 3.0 up, all of those actions and anything else I can think of are resolved by rolling a d20, applying a modifier, and trying to beat a target number. The base system is far, far less complex. Granted, options bloat can add a lot of complexity for not much depth. There’s a reason I tend to run my games out of the core books only, and it’s not because I don’t want to buy the splat books (which I usually do).</p><p></p><p></p><p>And it’s clear you’ve never played a game online if “patching some online things together” is what you think it looks like. But again with the words in my mouth. I have both played and run games both online and in person. I prefer in person when it’s possible but there are benefits and drawbacks of both, chief among them being ease of coordinating schedules.</p><p></p><p></p><p>K</p><p></p><p></p><p>Never said it was better.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, I have played and run online and in person. In person is preferable when it’s possible but it is not always possible, and there are other advantages to playing online as well, which I take full advantage of when in person isn’t possible.</p><p></p><p></p><p>That’s actually not the truth at all. Most of my coworkers play, all of my friends from outside of work play, much of my family plays, and I could easily go to my LGS, offer to run a game, and get more interested players than I am willing to run for. The only reason in person games are not always possible for me to run is schedule conflicts. We have busy lives now. When I was in college, this was not a problem and I was always able to find players with time to spare for in person games.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, not better, just different, and there are advantages and disadvantages to both. But there are more than enough players to go around, both globally and locally.</p><p></p><p></p><p>I’m not the one with the blinders, man. I’m embracing both the digital and the physical.</p><p></p><p></p><p>No, I don’t, you are the one assuming meaning that I am not putting into my comments.</p><p></p><p></p><p>False equivalence. To a straw man argument. Maybe it’s you who should stop railing against an imagined foolish youth and start engaging with the points actually being made by the human being you’re actually talking to.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Charlaquin, post: 7371442, member: 6779196"] Way to put words in my mouth, dude. I don’t pretend to know everything, nor do I ignore the advice of those who came before me. Just because I have a different perspective than you does not mean I am ignoring yours, or that I think mine is infallible. How about we leave the ad homenim aside and focus on the actual arguments being made. Never said I find them “amusing.” There’s a lot to like in both classic D&D and AD&D, and I have only respect for the trail they blazed. So, I’m other words, the added depth of AD&D was worth the added complexity for you. Depth is good. Complexity is bad. But depth always comes with some amount of complexity. The key is to get the most depth you can out of the least complexity you can. 5th Edition has 320 pages in the players handbook, not thousands. And while yes, 230 is a larger number than 230, that’s a poor indicator of complexity. What matters is what’s actually on those pages. Formatting and content play a big role. Sorry, but in AD&D there are a dozen or so separate subsystems for resolving different tasks. If I want to know if my character succeeds at bending the bars of a prison door, there’s a specific dice roll and table for that. If I want to pick the lock there’s a separate system for that. If I want to break the lock by hitting it with a weapon there’s a separate system for that. In any edition from 3.0 up, all of those actions and anything else I can think of are resolved by rolling a d20, applying a modifier, and trying to beat a target number. The base system is far, far less complex. Granted, options bloat can add a lot of complexity for not much depth. There’s a reason I tend to run my games out of the core books only, and it’s not because I don’t want to buy the splat books (which I usually do). And it’s clear you’ve never played a game online if “patching some online things together” is what you think it looks like. But again with the words in my mouth. I have both played and run games both online and in person. I prefer in person when it’s possible but there are benefits and drawbacks of both, chief among them being ease of coordinating schedules. K Never said it was better. Again, I have played and run online and in person. In person is preferable when it’s possible but it is not always possible, and there are other advantages to playing online as well, which I take full advantage of when in person isn’t possible. That’s actually not the truth at all. Most of my coworkers play, all of my friends from outside of work play, much of my family plays, and I could easily go to my LGS, offer to run a game, and get more interested players than I am willing to run for. The only reason in person games are not always possible for me to run is schedule conflicts. We have busy lives now. When I was in college, this was not a problem and I was always able to find players with time to spare for in person games. Again, not better, just different, and there are advantages and disadvantages to both. But there are more than enough players to go around, both globally and locally. I’m not the one with the blinders, man. I’m embracing both the digital and the physical. No, I don’t, you are the one assuming meaning that I am not putting into my comments. False equivalence. To a straw man argument. Maybe it’s you who should stop railing against an imagined foolish youth and start engaging with the points actually being made by the human being you’re actually talking to. [/QUOTE]
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