(LHHS) OOC Thread I

[Creamsteak]

Let me compare the Lizardman to a Saurial and see if they're OK for you, creamsteak:

There are 4 different races of Saurial in Dragon 292.
Bladebacks, Hornheads, Flyers, and Finheads.
I am hoping I can play a Longtail (a sauropod-based Saurial).

Saurial (Longtail) - +2 Str, +2 Cha, +2d8 HD, +1 Base Attack, +3 Ref, +4 Natural Armor, -3 Ranks/Skill, Multiattack, Large size.
(I took the Hornhead and changed the +2 INT to +2 CHA and decreased the natural armor from +5 to +4)

From Saurial qualities, Longtails have Cold Torpor (-5 to FORT saves and double damage vs cold environments), +4 to sonic based attacks, Scent feat, -4 to gas-based attacks, low-light vision and natural weapons. They have to use Saurial weapons and can't speak Common or any bonus language (except for Draconic) unless they spend language skill points for it.

Personally, I think it would be good if Saurials be granted a +4 circumstance bonus to Balance checks and attempts to Bull Rush or Trip them due to their tails. And please allow Longtail Saurials to have the Trample ability.
It fits the flavor of the race, and shouldn't be overpowering (it hasn't been at all in the Non-Iconic Adventure).

Change Size to Medium.
Make speed 40 feet anyway (as all lizardfolk in this campaign have)
Natural Armor keep at +5
+2 Str, +2 Cha are fine if they take a -2 Int.
+1 Base Attack and +3 Ref save come from your 2d8 HD so that's fine.
Lose Cold Sturpor and gain Poison Immunity (as Lizardfolk have)
Lose +4 Sonic Based Attacks
They only get Scent if thier Wis is 11 or higher (my rule)
Drop the -4 to gas based attacks
Keep the Languages and skills as you have them
use Lizardfolk Weapon Proficiencies (Greatclub, Claw, Bite, Javelin)
+4 Racial Jump Swim and Balance from Tail

Tell me what you need trample for exactly? I don't want to kill your character idea, but in order to trample a medium sized creature you have to be large... and most lizardfolk are not large...

If you want Trample, increase size from medium to large and incur all the size penalties. You can have trample instead of multiattack as your racial feat if you choose to increase to large size.

All of this at a meager +1 ECL, is that at all close to a deal? If not, we can open up a chat if your around.

 

[Creamsteak]

Currently Races look like this, and I think I almost found all my notes on the campaign world you guys are starting in. The general map will be up pretty soon...

Racial Selections
Aasimar (Breton) 42 Points – As Aasimar with +4 Heal, and +4 Knowledge (Religion)
High Elf (High Elf) 42 Points – As High Elf with +4 Alchemy, and +4 Knowledge (Arcana)
Tiefling (Imp) 42 Points – As Tiefling with +4 Diplomacy, and +4 Gather Information
Human (Nord) 42 Points – As Human with Electricity Resistance 11+Class Level, Cold Resistance 7+Class Level, and Shocking Grasp 1/day as a 1st level sorcerer.
Human (Redguard) 42 Points – As Human with Rage 1/day, not winded after rage, and +4 on Fortitude saves against Poison or Disease.
Wood Elf (Red Elf) 42 Points – As Red-Elf with proficient in all bows and crossbows, and with free Weapon Focus in a single type of Bow or Crossbow.
Drow (Dark Elf) 36 Points – As Drow with Fire Resistance 11+Character Level, No Light Blindness, Male and Female receive +2 Cha.
Lizardfold (Lizardfolk) 36 Points – As Lizardfolk with base movement of 40 ft, and immune to poison.
Orc (Orc) 42 Points – As Orc with Armor Proficiency (Light, Medium, and Heavy), Shield Proficiency, Weapon Proficiency (Simple and Martial: all), and No Light Blindness.

 

[Creamsteak]

Notice: I posted my 800th post two weeks ago, and I'm borderline on 950... humorous how being a moderator can increase your post count at a rate of 25 posts a day...

 

[Creamsteak]

Um, stats are scattered all over this page... just use the ones I listed for each race in the Rogues Gallery, they are the "most" correct ones I have right now.

 

[reapersaurus]

+4 Racial Jump Swim and Balance from Tail

If you want Trample, increase size from medium to large and incur all the size penalties. You can have trample instead of multiattack as your racial feat if you choose to increase to large size.

hmm.... for the most part, that sounds great, and it's a go!

It is important to me to have the Longtail be Large, but Trample isn't a necessity... just a neat ability.
Really, it does nothing other than make the target not be able to get out of the way of an Overrun.

So it looks good - I just wanted to ask about the skills.
It doesn't make sense that a Longtail Saurial (which is really a dinosaur-man) would be good at Jumping or Swimming.
They would probably be pretty bad at it, fairly immobile.
Is it OK that they get those bonuses instead to resisting Bull Rushes and Trips?
It's not important power-wise, just which flavor ability do you think is more appropriate?

A Saurial isn't a Lizardman, we're just using that as a good comparison.
It's a Dinosaur-man.

I looked for pictures on the net, but I can't find any.
Imagine a sauropod, like a Brontosaurus, but he is intelligent, humanlike and can walk on 2 legs.
Here's a 2E reference: http://silverlion.virtualave.net/fre/saurial.html

 

[Creamsteak]

hmm.... for the most part, that sounds great, and it's a go!

It is important to me to have the Longtail be Large, but Trample isn't a necessity... just a neat ability.
Really, it does nothing other than make the target not be able to get out of the way of an Overrun.

So it looks good - I just wanted to ask about the skills.
It doesn't make sense that a Longtail Saurial (which is really a dinosaur-man) would be good at Jumping or Swimming.
They would probably be pretty bad at it, fairly immobile.
Is it OK that they get those bonuses instead to resisting Bull Rushes and Trips?
It's not important power-wise, just which flavor ability do you think is more appropriate?

A Saurial isn't a Lizardman, we're just using that as a good comparison.
It's a Dinosaur-man.

I looked for pictures on the net, but I can't find any.
Imagine a sauropod, like a Brontosaurus, but he is intelligent, humanlike and can walk on 2 legs.
Here's a 2E reference: http://silverlion.virtualave.net/fre/saurial.html

Well the skills are the racial modifiers that you would have for being a lizardfolk. We are just assuming you are a rather abnormally big lizardfolk and have some differences. The bonus vs. Trips and the resistance to bull rush don't sound good to me honestly. If you are around, click the chatroom button above and join channel: IR
I'm there, and we can figure this out quickly.

 

[reapersaurus]

I'm sorry i didn't catch you before you replied- i went to sleep then.
I just checked the chat room, bur only see darkwolf (away, i think).

I'll join the thread in character in a bit - the skills are not really important, but I have to ask: Why do you keep insisting that a Saurial is a Lizardman?

They are as different as a elf is to a human.
They have similar abilities, but they don't hiss and live in swamps.
I know I'm treading into dangerous roleplaying territory here but Saurials as I understand have a distince culture.
They were kidnapped by an Evil god (moander) and brought to the Lost Vale in FR, and fairly recently got released from slavery.

The younger Saurials are curious about the outside world, and the world will start seeing these very unique races soon as they start making names for themselves, which is how I want to play Brontos "Brawn" Longneck.
CG defender of Finder Wyvernspur (the Saurials revere him).
Too bad I can't use the Charm AND Retribution domains...

 

[Creamsteak]

+4 circumstance bonus to Balance checks and attempts to Bull Rush or Trip them due to their tails

Heh, well I guess my resistance is entirely because this is my baby we are playing in. My campaign world is my baby. I love it with quite a bit of myself, and I pride myself on all the good points about it. One of the good points is the um... freedom I provide my players. I load them down with leads till they have so many they could never accomplish them all, and then I give them complete freedom to take whatever jobs they choose. I let them make attachments at thier own leisure, and I use every player lead I get. That's my kind of game.

But it's still my baby. In my baby, sauriel seem quite odd. I decided, upon reading your description, that they could be the predecesors of the lizardfolk, the brutish thugs that once were there. That's what I feel that sauriel can best represent in my campaign world. I don't feel that sauriel can represent dinosaur people... yet. I can fit that in as a character lead (an island of the dinosaur, like the 1st edition campaign based on that). It is a character lead I might use with you, if you follow it up.

This isn't Forgotten Realms. This isn't Scared Lands, Ravenloft, or Daggerfall. This isn't any of those, this is my strange, humerous, almost too generic campaign setting. Because of this, I'm quite protective of the setting. If I was using FR then I'd take my own hand to change it to fit player needs more, but this is my baby...

So in my final decision about your skills...

Fine, you can have your Bull rush and Trip attack resistance...

But it's exclusive to you, not your people.

 

[Lichtenhart]

Creamsteak, can I ask you how common are Imps in your world and how are they regarded by other people? I've got certain wild ideas that maybe don't fit your setting.

 

[Creamsteak]

Creamsteak, can I ask you how common are Imps in your world and how are they regarded by other people? I've got certain wild ideas that maybe don't fit your setting.

Imps are very common... All of the races are very common in some region or another. Imps have the approximate reputation of FR's Kender, though a bit um... meaner.

They are not considered outsiders (they are a sub-race of human), but thier abilities were extrapolated from Tieflings.

Imps tend to be the smallest medium sized race in this campaign setting (nameless btw). The also tend to be greedy, snide, and rather um... agrivating. Most imps are beat up on as children, and they grow up hating the other races. Imps almost always get thier revenge though...

Female Imps mate with Bretons or Nords about 25% of the time... just so you know. It's generally accepted that any elves mate with elves, and humans mate with humans, but cross breading beyond that is exceptionally uncommon.

Imp heroes (ones that are parts of legends) tend to be fighters, despite thier lack of fighting capacity. I guess it's sort of interesting in that way, the same way Nord's revere thier clerics... Imps also are relatively short-lived compared to humans of other types, probably because they lack the heartiness of the other races. If you play an Imp, be a schemer, that really fits this campaign setting.

Often times Imp Characters are (despite their lack of it) the charismatic person in thier group, because of the way they deal with people. They are good at operating for governments, as agents and retrievers. They are probably the least likely race to work in a group, so they are often loners...

I could rant on for awhile if you choose...