Limited Wish - No Exp Cost for spell duplication??

[DM2]

This question brought to you by a friendly in-game between-DMs dispute:

Does limited wish ONLY evoke a 300 xp (or more) cost when it is used to duplicate a spell that also has an exp cost?

Note that the XP Cost reads as follows in the spell description:

XP Cost: 300 XP or more (see above).

The only reference in Limited Wish's description to see, reads:

When a
limited wish duplicates a spell that has an XP cost, you must pay that cost or 300 XP, whichever is more.

One of us contends that the cost is ALWAYS 300 XP, no matter what you choose to do (even duplicate magic missile or something). One of us contends that the "When a limited wish duplicates a spell..." part of the description means the XP cost only applies when duplicating spells that also have XP costs.

Someone wanna prove one of us right?

Thanks,

DM2

 

[Hypersmurf]

One of us contends that the cost is ALWAYS 300 XP, no matter what you choose to do (even duplicate magic missile or something).

That's right.

Limited Wish has an XP component. This XP component is 300 XP or more.

The "or more" kicks in if you're duplicating a spell with an XP cost of more than 300.

Compare Miracle, which only sometimes has an XP component: its component entry is "V, S, XP (see text)" - because there is only an XP component under certain conditions, explained in the text.

As opposed to Limited Wish, whose component entry is "V, S, XP". The is no "see text", because the existence of an XP component is not conditional. There is always an XP component. 300 or more.

-Hyp.

 

[thatdarncat]

They've tightened up the wording from 3.0, which might be why you were getting confused. In 3.0, the wording seemed to say that duplicating a spell did not incur an xp cost. We're still using that in our games - it still doesn't make wish a spell that EVERYONE should take - I'm more likely to load up on timestops and Energy Drains.

 

[DM2]

Anyone care to contend with hypersmurf and argue the other side?

I'll remind that we're just talking about limited wish here, not wish, as they have totally different wording (though comparisons are useful).

DM2

 

[Otterscrubber]

Hard to argue the other side as Hyper is right as usual. I think it is solid game balance to require 300xp at a minimum, giving you access to every 6th level sorc/wiz spell or every 5th level spell of any kind in the game. That is huge flexibility when you need it that is only available to Arcane caster. Divine casters have nothing of the kind at their disposal, perhaps making up for the fact they have access to all their spells when prepping them.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Divine casters have nothing of the kind at their disposal...

You mean apart from Miracle?

-Hyp.

 

[Piratecat]

Anyone care to contend with hypersmurf and argue the other side?

Nope. It seems pretty clear to me.

 

[jgsugden]

Anyone care to contend with hypersmurf and argue the other side?

I'd love to, but he is 100% correct.

 

[Nightfall]

I'd have to agree. Unless it has a greater XP cost, you still lose only the 300 for casting say a fireball.

 

[DM2]

Well, if you thought I was the one who thought it was free to dup spells, then I did a good job of remaining impartial to avoid influencing the results

Later,

DM2