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<blockquote data-quote="Lidgar" data-source="post: 7006198" data-attributes="member: 28334">It's not a silly question at all. In fact, surprise and stealth rules are probably one of the most discussed rules on these here forums. That and &quot;canon&quot; versus &quot;rules&quot; and other enticing topics. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />I think the reason there is confusion for new players (and even old ones that are new to 5e) is that &quot;surprise&quot; in 5e is really more like a condition, brought about by specific circumstances. It does not equate to a group being unaware of a specific creature. Surprise is only triggered if one side is totally unaware of any threat.So if the adventure begins with the party starting in an open road only 50 feet away from the goblins, there is no way the goblins can be surprised, as they can clearly see the wagon and horses (and presumably at least some of the party). Therefore they see a threat and cannot be surprised. They are watching the road and are aware of a threat and therefore cannot be caught off-guard, even if not necessarily aware of the entire threat (like a rogue scouting in the woods).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Lidgar, post: 7006198, member: 28334"] It's not a silly question at all. In fact, surprise and stealth rules are probably one of the most discussed rules on these here forums. That and "canon" versus "rules" and other enticing topics. :) I think the reason there is confusion for new players (and even old ones that are new to 5e) is that "surprise" in 5e is really more like a condition, brought about by specific circumstances. It does not equate to a group being unaware of a specific creature. Surprise is only triggered if one side is totally unaware of any threat. So if the adventure begins with the party starting in an open road only 50 feet away from the goblins, there is no way the goblins can be surprised, as they can clearly see the wagon and horses (and presumably at least some of the party). Therefore they see a threat and cannot be surprised. They are watching the road and are aware of a threat and therefore cannot be caught off-guard, even if not necessarily aware of the entire threat (like a rogue scouting in the woods). [/QUOTE]

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