Local Games Stores Are Dead!

[Mistwell]

This is a spinoff from this thread:

http://enworld.cyberstreet.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=1059241#post1059241

I wrote:

The other way I feel PDFs can hurt the long term industry is by not marketing the industry through the product covers and shelf space at stores (which is one of the primary methods a niche industry has to bring in new people to the hobby). When people go to a store to look at a chess set or to buy a monopoly game, and they see a D&D product (or an entire wall of D&D products), there is a chance they will become interested and inquire further. PDFs do not bring in new people at the same level hardcopy products do.

In response, Cergorach wrote:

This is old school thinking! More and more people are using the internet as a way to satisfy their hobby needs. FLGS are getting more and more difficult to operate, more people want to buy through the internet for various reasons (cheaper, ease of use, more stuff to choose from, etc.). Industries change, if the people who work in those industries don't keep up, they'll be out of a job. Just how many companies do you know of that still handwrite books...

I would very much like people's reaction to this. As someone who is considering opening a local game story, I couldn't possibly disagree more with Cergorach. But I would like to hear from other people first.

 

[jgbrowning]

I can see both logical argument from both sides.

In thirty years, I could easily see books themselves become a "luxury" item. IE. most people getting their reading material in an electronic format.

Personally, I don't think FLGS are in trouble right now. Ten years from now, however, things could be quite different.

joe b.

 

[d20Dwarf]

The days of FLGS that just provide products for sale are quickly coming to an end. Demo games, tournaments, and leagues for every game possible are the way to go, and with companies such as Fantasy Flight Games, AEG, and WizKids providing fully incentivized demo teams at no cost to the FLGS, I can't believe any still exist that don't encourage such activities.

The best store I've ever seen in this regard is Outpost 2000 in the Twin Cities. Jeff the owner ran tournaments 6 days of the week, sometimes multiple tournaments on the same night. He charged no entry fee except that you had to buy 1 or 2 packs of whatever game you were playing. In this way he was able to move product, encourage people to come into the store, and very rarely did anyone ever buy only the minimum I'm sure.

So my advice to new store owners is, don't just stock up on gaming supplies then sit there. You need to recruit local Warlords, Judges, Flight Crew, and anything else you can to come to your store and run tournaments. Be as friendly as possible to these tournaments, and don't try to make money on entry fees, instead encourage the people in your store to buy things.

 

[Breakdaddy]

I think its very possible to run a gaming store successfully. The caveat here is that in order to run one successfully the employees need to go up and beyond the normal customer service standards. Unfortunately, time and time again I have seen local gaming stores (Ive moved around a lot having been military) that have employees who show little regard for the customer, unwillingness to cater to customer needs (many wont even special order for you!), and a general lack of knowledge of the products they carry. These stores, imho, are destined to fail and go out of business (Ive seen it in a few cases already). With internet bookstores offering discounted items quicky and with minimal hassle, the gaming store proprieter must increasingly raise the bar for customer service and product availability in their store.

 

[Darkness]

Cergorach apparently said:
Just how many companies do you know of that still handwrite books...

Printed books are generally of a higher production quality than handwritten books.
.pds are certainly not a very good substitute for printed books, though.

So this argument holds little water in the majority of cases.

 

[Balgus]

jgbrowning:In thirty years, I could easily see books themselves become a "luxury" item. IE. most people getting their reading material in an electronic format.

I would really doubt it. As long as there are people who enjoy in keeping a hard copy, there will always be a need.

Besides, there are poeple like me who have bad eyesight, and can't stare at a monitor for more than 15 minutes at a time, even though I often do. That way, i would rather have a book that I can put downa nd rest my eyes anytime without having to worry about how much electricity I am wasting (even though I know it is very minimal)

And a book cost $30 and you can lug it anywhere. Whereas a desktop costs more- and doesn't go anywhere. An iBook costs much more, so i can't see anyone giving up the cheap alternative yet. And printing it off the web just feels funny to me. You sit down at a gaming table and pull out a 500 page folder with printouts from yesteryear... the printing cost itself would have paid for the book itself, and with the pride of knowing that you have supported the designers and creators of that book...

 

[Zogg]

I would have to say, "Open up a FLGS!" simply because I very much like them and I don't see them going out of style (or business) anytime soon.

On the flip side, I wouldn't expect any huge profit from opening and running a FLGS either. You will definitely need to label yourself as a "board gaming" store and carry comics as well if you want to appeal to a larger audience and see some semblance of profitability.

While sales of gaming PDF's may increase with time, there is never an online substitution for rolling dice, holding a fresh comic book in your hands, or moving your top hat onto "Boardwalk" and laughing evilly at your family & friends as you shell out $400 for it.

 

[Harlock]

or moving your top hat onto "Boardwalk" and laughing evilly at your family & friends as you shell out $400 for it.

Heh, you sound like my kind of gamer, Zogg.

 

[Cergorach]

@Mistwell
I'm not saying that the FLGS is a stupid endevour, but it's quickly becomming not so attractive anymore. Just as D20Dwarf said, they need to organize a lot of activity around the store to get people to come. This wasn't really neccessary ten years ago, mostly because you couldn't get your stuff from any other place. These days you can get your stuff from a Game Web Store for 20%-30% off, from Big Book Web Stores even at 30%-40% off. Your FLGS better have some very attractive incentives to get you to buy at his store. Hell, i'm all for "If you play there, you buy there.".

I think more and more game stores will be replaced by web stores and you'll probably see something along the lines as a game cafe (similar to an internet cafe). A lot of people will probably find it a lot more attractive than sitting in a game store with a game shop clerq trying to push you some Pokemon, while your quietly trying to play machiavelli with your friends...

Printed books are generally of a higher production quality than handwritten books.
.pds are certainly not a very good substitute for printed books, though.

So this argument holds little water in the majority of cases.

So you've never seen one of those handwritten bibles that some Monk Copied? Those things are huge and sturdy! The only reason they're not in a good condition at the moment is because they are old, really old (couple of hundred years). I don't see your PHB surviving so long in such a good condition.

I would really doubt it. As long as there are people who enjoy in keeping a hard copy, there will always be a need.

Besides, there are poeple like me who have bad eyesight, and can't stare at a monitor for more than 15 minutes at a time, even though I often do. That way, i would rather have a book that I can put downa nd rest my eyes anytime without having to worry about how much electricity I am wasting (even though I know it is very minimal)

And a book cost $30 and you can lug it anywhere. Whereas a desktop costs more- and doesn't go anywhere. An iBook costs much more, so i can't see anyone giving up the cheap alternative yet. And printing it off the web just feels funny to me. You sit down at a gaming table and pull out a 500 page folder with printouts from yesteryear... the printing cost itself would have paid for the book itself, and with the pride of knowing that you have supported the designers and creators of that book...

Your obviously not very up to date with the technological advances of our time. Electronic paper is just around the corner. Electronic paper can be reused and reused, thus you'll end up with only the need for one electronic paper book with a couple of Gigs of flash memory that'll hold a couple of hundred books.

Today you might get the same effect with a tablet pc, but the resolution is still to low IMHO. I'm using a pda to read my novels these days, saves me a lot of damned space and i don't have to carry around a log of a book (Dune is big!) And i'm never with out a dictionary (dutch to pau-pau zulu anyone ;-)

I'm still looking for a way to comfortly read game material, but i highly doubt that it'll work fine on only 240*320, maybe when the 480*640 pdas become main stream in a year or so...

 

[hellbender]

FLGS are not in any danger, other than from discount houses. People might buy .pdf files with a few pages, however, this issue has already come and gone in the publishing world, and the result is PoD publishing (Print on Demand). This is an envrionmentally friendlier method than traditional printing as only the books that are ordered are printed.

hellbender