Long-Term Skill Challenges and Encounter Powers

[Lizard]

The general rule is, an encounter power can be used once every 5 minutes "out of combat", correct?

So -- I just got a Utility 2 power, Crucial Advice, or, as written on my character sheet, "You're Doing It Wrong". This allows anyone who trying an untrained skill in which I am trained to reroll it with a bonus equal to my Wisdom modifier, currently +1. Anyway, if the DM says we're doing a SC where each 'round' represents an hour or more,would it not make sense to let me use this ability each go-round, since more than 5 minutes are passing? The DM is of the opinion that the entire SC is a single "encounter".

Is there any official word on this?

 

[DracoSuave]

You can't take short rests in the middle of an encounter.

So you can't recharge your encounter powers.

 

[Syrsuro]

I would rule that your DM is right.

(Both by definition and also because skill challenges are considered to be single encounters).

Carl

 

[Starglim]

PHB p. 179: "A skill challenge is an encounter.."
p. 54: "An encounter power can be used once per encounter." You must take a short rest to reuse an encounter power, but note that this section does not say that you get the encounter power back after a short rest: the rest is necessary, but not sufficient.

An encounter is a unit of narrative, not a unit of time. edit: Each skill check could take a month and you would still not be able to reuse the same encounter power in that encounter.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

The general rule is, an encounter power can be used once every 5 minutes "out of combat", correct?

So -- I just got a Utility 2 power, Crucial Advice, or, as written on my character sheet, "You're Doing It Wrong". This allows anyone who trying an untrained skill in which I am trained to reroll it with a bonus equal to my Wisdom modifier, currently +1. Anyway, if the DM says we're doing a SC where each 'round' represents an hour or more,would it not make sense to let me use this ability each go-round, since more than 5 minutes are passing? The DM is of the opinion that the entire SC is a single "encounter".

Is there any official word on this?

It basically depends on if you are allowed to take a short rest or not.

I think I remember that some of the skill challenges in P2: Demon Queen Enclave allow a short rest, but the challenges there typically work a little differently then the challenges in the DMG. I think those basically worked like. "Every <UNIT OF TIME>" each party member tries to do something for the challenge. If more party members fail then succeed, this counts as a failure and you do not progress. Under these circumstances, regaining an encounter power for every check would probably not be unbalanced.

Leaving the area of RAW:
Before the Core Rules were published and we were discussing things about Encounter Powers, one idea I had is that you could theoretically have multiple parallel encounters running. You could have a long-time skill challenge that is interrupted with you doing certain things (maybe connected to the challenge, maybe not). As an example, you might be running a long-time skill challenge trying to get an audience with the king. You have to run around the entire city to call in favors or fulfill some tasks to get aid in your goal. During your running through the city, you might enter a combat encounter (maybe a random encounter, maybe a rival holding a grudge against you).
My idea now would be that if you had an encounter power that you already used in your "Audience" challenge, you could still use it in this encounter, since it's not part of the challenge. Or if you use it in this encounter, you can still use during the Audience challenge.

That's of course not an interpretation by RAW, but it might make a fine house-rule. (You might try it as a little... "free" interpretation of RAW if you say that a short rest refers to specific encounters. In a long running challenge, you couldn't find rest regarding that challenge, since your mind would still be occupied with it.)

 

[Lizard]

You can't take short rests in the middle of an encounter.

So you can't recharge your encounter powers.

So an SC that represents, say, a day of research, at no point did anyone get to sit still for five minutes? Must have been one *happenin'* library! (Which might make more sense if this were a CoC game... )

OK, the consensus seems to be that, all internal logic to the contrary, an "encounter" can be a year long and your powers never recharge during it. That's the way it goes, I guess.

 

[Starglim]

Leaving the area of RAW:
Before the Core Rules were published and we were discussing things about Encounter Powers, one idea I had is that you could theoretically have multiple parallel encounters running. You could have a long-time skill challenge that is interrupted with you doing certain things (maybe connected to the challenge, maybe not). As an example, you might be running a long-time skill challenge trying to get an audience with the king. You have to run around the entire city to call in favors or fulfill some tasks to get aid in your goal. During your running through the city, you might enter a combat encounter (maybe a random encounter, maybe a rival holding a grudge against you).
My idea now would be that if you had an encounter power that you already used in your "Audience" challenge, you could still use it in this encounter, since it's not part of the challenge. Or if you use it in this encounter, you can still use during the Audience challenge.

I'd certainly agree and was thinking the same thing earlier.

 

[Mengu]

In a skill challenge, you're really allowed to do anything. So there is no reason why as part of the skill challenge, you couldn't say, we are going to hunker down behind these bushes while half the party keeps watch, the other half is going to take a short rest. If it makes sense in the context of the skill challenge, it's just another roll perhaps to be done by the person finding the hiding place to make sure it's reasonably safe.

But if the skill challenge involves chasing another boat down a rapid stream while not losing sight of it, then rest is a luxury that can't be afforded. So again, it has to make sense in the context of the skill challenge.

 

[Starglim]

You can't take short rests in the middle of an encounter.

So you can't recharge your encounter powers.

As mentioned a few posts back, I don't believe a short rest will allow you to reuse your encounter power, if it's still the same encounter.

In a skill challenge, you're really allowed to do anything. So there is no reason why as part of the skill challenge, you couldn't say, we are going to hunker down behind these bushes while half the party keeps watch, the other half is going to take a short rest.

Or an extended rest, if you prefer. Neither will get back your encounter power, though it might heal you or allow various other benefits that could help in the skill challenge.

 

[Taralan]

Wouldn't that create a strange result tough. If the power was a daily, it could be recharged by an extended rest in a long term skill challenge, but yet the encounter power cannot because it is still the same encounter ? Surely this is not correct.

That said, I agree that this particular encounter power would be far too powerful if allowed to work at will in a long term skill challenge.

I guess this is one case where the united structure of 4e powers fails because of the vast difference between a narrative encounter like a skill challenge is just too different from a combat encounter ...