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Low Level Grapple-Shove Builds
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<blockquote data-quote="Myzzrym" data-source="post: 7818452" data-attributes="member: 6989911"><p>Hey there folks!</p><p></p><p>I'm about to play in a new campaign and wanted to explore some Grapple-Shove Builds, and had a few ideas. Looking for inputs!</p><p></p><p>Now since it's the beginning of the campaign, I'm not planning for high level builds (like level 10+), so I may not be making the best "long-term" decisions. Also, I do not believe my DM allows for multiclassing so that's out.</p><p></p><p>I am currently hesitating between Human Fighter or Rogue:</p><p></p><p>Fighter:</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Focus on STR, fairly standard for Fighters</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Pick Prodigy Feat at level 1 to get Expertise on Athletics, buffing Grapple / Shove rolls. It's the only moment I can pick up Expertise since no Multiclassing.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Game plan would be: Round 1 Grapple, Round 2 Shove, Round 3+ Lay down the pain (if the opponent hasn't escaped by then). Against multiple enemies, just go with Sword and Shield standard fighting.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">If I really want to lock down someone, do both with Action Surge.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">From level 4, pick up Shield Master Feat. Round 1 (empty hand + shield) Grapple => Shove (Bonus Action) => Drop Shield, Round 2 Draw sword and lay the pain. This way I always have one free hand to maintain grapple.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Question: What archetype would fit best? I'm leaning towards Battle Master for utility, but I'm wondering if I'm missing some options.</li> </ul><p></p><p>Rogue:</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Focus on STR, which usually can be a dump stat for Rogue.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Expertise is built in for Rogue, so I could go for another Race for bonus STR, or I'm wondering if I should go Moderately Armored Feat to get Shield Proficiency (for Shield Master at level 4).</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Game plan is the same, but I get Sneak Attack Bonus on top of the regular damage</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Level 4 Shield Master (if I got Moderately Armored), or the good old Lucky feat otherwise to reroll botched rolls.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Question: What archetype would fit best? Arcane Trickster could add some utility when I can't get in melee.</li> </ul><p></p><p>From my perspective:</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Fighter gives me something more "safe", as it still gets access to good AC / HP, decent damage, features that can work in pretty much every situations.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Rogue allows me for something that deals more damage with Sneak Attack once the setup is complete, more skills for outside combat, and Cunning Action helps me drag my victims away since I can dash with a bonus action.</li> </ul><p></p><p>At the moment I'm more leaning towards Rogue, although it kinds of bum me out to use my level 1 Feat just to get shield proficiency. However, I wasn't able to find a way to pack in Grapple + Shove quickly otherwise before level 5 (where you could use 1 attack to grapple & 1 attack to shove). I'm also toying around with the idea of Tavern Brawler Feat, but you can't do Shove followed by Grab (since you need to make an unarmed / improvised weapon attack to grapple as a Bonus Action, which shove isn't afaik) unlike Shield Master where you can do Grab followed by Shove (since you need only to do an Attack Action, which Grab is). So the only benefit would be that I can do an improvised weapon attack with my grab, but it would fall to the DM to allow Sneak Attack damage with it. </p><p></p><p>RP-speaking I'm basically playing a dirty fighter who goes for low blows and goes in close and personal with grappling and pushing people around, so both classes would fit.</p><p></p><p>What's your take on it?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Myzzrym, post: 7818452, member: 6989911"] Hey there folks! I'm about to play in a new campaign and wanted to explore some Grapple-Shove Builds, and had a few ideas. Looking for inputs! Now since it's the beginning of the campaign, I'm not planning for high level builds (like level 10+), so I may not be making the best "long-term" decisions. Also, I do not believe my DM allows for multiclassing so that's out. I am currently hesitating between Human Fighter or Rogue: Fighter: [LIST] [*]Focus on STR, fairly standard for Fighters [*]Pick Prodigy Feat at level 1 to get Expertise on Athletics, buffing Grapple / Shove rolls. It's the only moment I can pick up Expertise since no Multiclassing. [*]Game plan would be: Round 1 Grapple, Round 2 Shove, Round 3+ Lay down the pain (if the opponent hasn't escaped by then). Against multiple enemies, just go with Sword and Shield standard fighting. [*]If I really want to lock down someone, do both with Action Surge. [*]From level 4, pick up Shield Master Feat. Round 1 (empty hand + shield) Grapple => Shove (Bonus Action) => Drop Shield, Round 2 Draw sword and lay the pain. This way I always have one free hand to maintain grapple. [*]Question: What archetype would fit best? I'm leaning towards Battle Master for utility, but I'm wondering if I'm missing some options. [/LIST] Rogue: [LIST] [*]Focus on STR, which usually can be a dump stat for Rogue. [*]Expertise is built in for Rogue, so I could go for another Race for bonus STR, or I'm wondering if I should go Moderately Armored Feat to get Shield Proficiency (for Shield Master at level 4). [*]Game plan is the same, but I get Sneak Attack Bonus on top of the regular damage [*]Level 4 Shield Master (if I got Moderately Armored), or the good old Lucky feat otherwise to reroll botched rolls. [*]Question: What archetype would fit best? Arcane Trickster could add some utility when I can't get in melee. [/LIST] From my perspective: [LIST] [*]Fighter gives me something more "safe", as it still gets access to good AC / HP, decent damage, features that can work in pretty much every situations. [*]Rogue allows me for something that deals more damage with Sneak Attack once the setup is complete, more skills for outside combat, and Cunning Action helps me drag my victims away since I can dash with a bonus action. [/LIST] At the moment I'm more leaning towards Rogue, although it kinds of bum me out to use my level 1 Feat just to get shield proficiency. However, I wasn't able to find a way to pack in Grapple + Shove quickly otherwise before level 5 (where you could use 1 attack to grapple & 1 attack to shove). I'm also toying around with the idea of Tavern Brawler Feat, but you can't do Shove followed by Grab (since you need to make an unarmed / improvised weapon attack to grapple as a Bonus Action, which shove isn't afaik) unlike Shield Master where you can do Grab followed by Shove (since you need only to do an Attack Action, which Grab is). So the only benefit would be that I can do an improvised weapon attack with my grab, but it would fall to the DM to allow Sneak Attack damage with it. RP-speaking I'm basically playing a dirty fighter who goes for low blows and goes in close and personal with grappling and pushing people around, so both classes would fit. What's your take on it? [/QUOTE]
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