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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Low-level Wizards in PF2 - are they still underpowered?
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<blockquote data-quote="CapnZapp" data-source="post: 7786360" data-attributes="member: 12731"><p>You are most definitely not missing something.</p><p></p><p>However, I can't believe the low performance of spells is by accident. Not when it it so obvious.</p><p></p><p>You mention the Barbarian. Another contender for "the most dust the Wizard is left in" <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> would be the Ranger - who can make four(!) attacks in a round, at no or very low penalties, already at first level.</p><p></p><p>Of course no 1st level spell can compare to that. (When you consider the Barbarian can do it every round all day long)</p><p></p><p>Also consider <em>how everybody has more hit points now</em>. Monsters are not likely to go down in one hit. For a martial, not a problem, since you now have triple the amount of attacks you would have in most other D&D.</p><p></p><p>A spell will also not bring them down, but <em>you still have only one spell per round</em>. Even worse, you have maybe three spells in total! Spending your spell to wound but not kill maybe three critters is a poor use in this light (=you only being able to do this once or twice again).</p><p></p><p>To me, the systemic changes to the core rules is what brings this about. This would (should?) be obvious to the devs from day one. Still, they haven't massively boosted first level spells.</p><p></p><p>So it's time to <strong>completely change our perception</strong> of what it means to be a low-level spellcaster. At first level, <strong>simply forget about offensive spells</strong>. You are much better off using cantrips... (or, dare I say it, actual physical violence? After all, the differences between classes at level 1 are minimal, so picking up a stick isn't that much worse than any other level 1 character with a stick...) to deal damage.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>PS. It's worth thinking about how the ability to kill monsters by magic is not a given right in many fantasy games. In WFRP, for instance, you're not even allowed real spells until you graduate from being a Wizard's Apprentice.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="CapnZapp, post: 7786360, member: 12731"] You are most definitely not missing something. However, I can't believe the low performance of spells is by accident. Not when it it so obvious. You mention the Barbarian. Another contender for "the most dust the Wizard is left in" :) would be the Ranger - who can make four(!) attacks in a round, at no or very low penalties, already at first level. Of course no 1st level spell can compare to that. (When you consider the Barbarian can do it every round all day long) Also consider [I]how everybody has more hit points now[/I]. Monsters are not likely to go down in one hit. For a martial, not a problem, since you now have triple the amount of attacks you would have in most other D&D. A spell will also not bring them down, but [I]you still have only one spell per round[/I]. Even worse, you have maybe three spells in total! Spending your spell to wound but not kill maybe three critters is a poor use in this light (=you only being able to do this once or twice again). To me, the systemic changes to the core rules is what brings this about. This would (should?) be obvious to the devs from day one. Still, they haven't massively boosted first level spells. So it's time to [B]completely change our perception[/B] of what it means to be a low-level spellcaster. At first level, [B]simply forget about offensive spells[/B]. You are much better off using cantrips... (or, dare I say it, actual physical violence? After all, the differences between classes at level 1 are minimal, so picking up a stick isn't that much worse than any other level 1 character with a stick...) to deal damage. PS. It's worth thinking about how the ability to kill monsters by magic is not a given right in many fantasy games. In WFRP, for instance, you're not even allowed real spells until you graduate from being a Wizard's Apprentice. [/QUOTE]
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Low-level Wizards in PF2 - are they still underpowered?
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