Low magic rulebook anyone?

[Turjan]

BTW I'm not planning on writing this, I've got other projects on the go. Unless, of course, someone wants to send me a letter of intent to publish it. Then I will reprioritize

Well, as a foreigner with six meager years of school English to boast of I feel far from qualified for writing a complete rulebook in English . I prefer to spare the humble public this dubious experience rather than make a fool of myself . If I'll have to do that kind of setting on my own, it will most probably be in German.

 

[Turjan]

double post, sorry

 

[Storminator]

Quick fix: Base a character's DR penetration on his wisdom or charisma bonus. "Gotta have faith." Personally I would lean towards Charisma as it's the governing stat for turning undead, it fits the concept better.


That's a good one. But in a really useful general supplement, it couldn't be the only one. This assumes 1) DR is something that is not tangible or physical (a tough hide) and 2) Bards should be better at penetrating DR than Barbarians.

<SNIP>

Why not base DR penetration on iterative attacks? For each attack beyond the first, you can penetrate an additional plus of DR. That brings your mightiest warriors up to +3, and if you tacked on a wis/cha progression on top of that, you'd have a reasonable system. Perhaps if wis or cha is 18 or greater, you add a plus one, and let those plusses stack. So a 16th level fighter type with an 18 cha and an 18 wis gets +5 DR penetration.

Of course then you still have all the other issues.

PS

 

[MThibault]

Well, that would work for some people. I don't really like the way that it makes bards and clerics as good (or better at lower levels) at overcoming DR as fighters and rangers. But that's just my preference.

Cheers.

 

[Storminator]

Well, that would work for some people. I don't really like the way that it makes bards and clerics as good (or better at lower levels) at overcoming DR as fighters and rangers. But that's just my preference.

Cheers.

Why not? Not all DR is based on anything physical, so wouldn't make sense that someone with nearly supernatural insight would penetrate the DR better than the guy with the sword?

PS

 

[thg jim]

Jim, in all seriousness: What specifically "doesn't make sense" about the magic item creation rules as written?

Wulf

Well, for one thing...everything. Just because taking XP away from a character makes him less likely to create a magic item, how exactly does that make any "real" sense? How do you have two magic items that do exactly the same thing and their costs vary by tens of thousands of gold pieces. Try to take the magic items as they exist and reverse engineer them and I think you will find that the system is broken. Is it usable? Of course. Does it make any sense? No.

I could go on with this but you will have to wait until the book is closer to release to get some of the actual contextual evidence.

 

[Thorin Stoutfoot]

Well, for one thing...everything. Just because taking XP away from a character makes him less likely to create a magic item, how exactly does that make any "real" sense? How do you have two magic items that do exactly the same thing and their costs vary by tens of thousands of gold pieces. Try to take the magic items as they exist and reverse engineer them and I think you will find that the system is broken. Is it usable? Of course. Does it make any sense? No.

Pah! Fie upon thee! Literature abounds with characters who've put huge amounts of their essence into their magic items. Sauron and his one ring, Morpheus and his items of office (like the ruby, his helm, and his bag of sand). So the fact that making a magic item drains you of your essence doesn't "make sense" is rubbish.

As for the second half of your argument, I'll refer you to Monte Cook's article on this:
http://www.montecook.com/arch_dmonly3.html#judgment

Sounds like I've got another publisher to add to my "doesn't grok D&D, avoid purchases" list.

 

[MThibault]

"Why not? Not all DR is based on anything physical, so wouldn't make sense that someone with nearly supernatural insight would penetrate the DR better than the guy with the sword?"

Sure. I'm not necessarily saying that it definitely shouldn't be in the supplement. I'm just saying that if it is the only system in the supplement it is not going to satisfy a majority of customers.

First of all some DR is based on physical properties of a shell or carapace. Even the DR that is fundamentally supernatural might (depending on your imaginative assumptions) just be an enhancement to physical properties. And, not to put too fine a point on it, Wisdom or Charisma does not necessarily provide supernatural insight for a non-spellcasting class.

Another route to go would be to use Spot or Knowledge (Monster), depending on your preferences, to overcome DR. A Knowledge (Monster) check would allow the individual character to know where the weak points are in the protection, or the method for overcoming that protection. A spot check would be more immediate. You would roll each round to determine if you see the weak point in time to aim for it. Each of these options is based on different conceptions of what DR is.

Not only are you trying to sell a game-mechanic you are selling in-game assumptions, and that just makes it extremely tricky.

 

[TSL]

For what it's worth, lads, I grappled with a number of the issues you all have raised during the design of Skull & Bones.

I concluded that if you don't have ever increasing magic armor / defenses - you don't need ever increasing +s to your weapons.

And DR doesn't do much in the face of cannon fire.

 

[jmucchiello]

I concluded that if you don't have ever increasing magic armor / defenses - you don't need ever increasing +s to your weapons.

Yes, but we're discussing what to do with established monsters in a low-magic game. IOW: I want to pitch the magic down 3 notches (no rangers with spells, everliving monks, bards has some spell-like abilities but a not a who magic list, paladins become a PrC (without spells), clerics/druids/wizards use the current bard progression). How do I adjust a CR 10 creature so that a 10th level party (with these magic assumptions) so that they can take it on?

Joe