[M&M] Question about Flaws and Powers as Extras

[hobgoblin]

and that in essence is the core of any roleplaying system...

 

[Thanee]

Of course. It would just be nice to know the way it is intended.

This is the kind of question that shouldnt be posted for Steve. The man has more important things to do than answer a question that anyone could have answered in 1 minute using the search function.

Well, I couldn't. I just got different answers to the same question.

The answer is no the flaws do not have to apply to every extra in a power. They may be applied individually to an extra or to the entire power. The cost break is the same. Traditionally extras cannot be flawed to cost less than 1pp per rank.

STEVE'S ANSWER

Bye
Thanee

 

[hobgoblin]

steve's answer was as expected, but what about non-power extras? most likely they do if they have an effect that dont depend on a specific power

hmm, i just got thinking, what happens to range if i take a touch power as a extras to a line of sight power? do they have varying range or do the range become LOS for all? and have this been asked before(most likely)?

 

[Insight]

steve's answer was as expected, but what about non-power extras? most likely they do if they have an effect that dont depend on a specific power

hmm, i just got thinking, what happens to range if i take a touch power as a extras to a line of sight power? do they have varying range or do the range become LOS for all? and have this been asked before(most likely)?

Powers as extras are self-contained, and do not inherit attributes from the parent power. Therefore, a touch power is still a touch power if it's taken as an extra. Likewise, a ranged power taken as an extra of a touch power can still be used at range.

A good example of this:

Let's say you take Energy Blast and want Energy Field as an extra (there are times when you might want it as an extra instead of a power stunt, but that's an entirely different discussion). In this case, energy field stays as a touch power, while you can still fire your EB at range.

In a related example, let's say you have EB as an extra on the Transfer power (not sure how this might happen, but you never know). In this case, Transfer is still a touch power, while EB is still ranged.

You can, of course, apply flaws or extra to make the extras match the base power's range if you wish.

 

[Thanee]

Slightly off topic

One question... I've heard this a few times now, but can't make any sense out of it.

How do you learn powers as power stunts of other powers!?

Power stunts are feats, right? They don't have ranks.
How would that work? And what would be the point of it?

Bye
Thanee

 

[Insight]

One question... I've heard this a few times now, but can't make any sense out of it.

How do you learn powers as power stunts of other powers!?

Power stunts are feats, right? They don't have ranks.
How would that work? And what would be the point of it?

Bye
Thanee

By learning, I am assuming you mean 'add after character creation'. To do this, use your pp to buy the power stunt.

In order for a power to qualify as a power stunt for another power, it has to be of the same type. In other words, let's say you have Strike (Melee) as the base power, the prospective power stunt would need to be an attack type power, such as Energy Blast, Snare, Stun, etc.

Also, the prospective power stunt would need to be of the same cost/rank as the base power or less. Therefore, you couldn't add an autofire continuous energy blast as a power stunt on a base strike (melee) because the cost of the EB is a lot more than the strike.

In terms of ranks, a Power Stunt is always the same ranks as the base power. There's not much you can do about that. You could, I suppose, add flaws to a Power Stunt to make it cost 1pp instead of 2pp in an attempt to limit the Power Stunt for some reason.

Though Power Stunts cost the same as Feats, and are somewhat interchangeable, I wouldn't necessarily characterize them as being the same thing. Each has a specific role in the game, and should be viewed as separate entities.

In terms of why you would want a power stunt? Well, it depends on your character concept, as things usually do. Power Stunts are offshoots of your base powers, and some characters will have them, and some won't.

In terms of point cost, a Power Stunt is more cost-effective than an Extra, but there are a few drawbacks. First, in order to qualify as a Power Stunt, see above. Also, Power Stunts cannot operate at the same time as the base power. This is not usually a problem - especially if you have designed your character the right way. But you could run into problems if you add a snare to a continuous EB or something to that effect, because the Power Stunt cannot be used if the base power is still going.

 

[The Grackle]

Powers as extras are self-contained, and do not inherit attributes from the parent power. Therefore, a touch power is still a touch power if it's taken as an extra. Likewise, a ranged power taken as an extra of a touch power can still be used at range.

This is kinda why I thought that flaws from the base didn't apply to the extra powers.

 

[The Grackle]

Also, the prospective power stunt would need to be of the same cost/rank as the base power or less. Therefore, you couldn't add an autofire continuous energy blast as a power stunt on a base strike (melee) because the cost of the EB is a lot more than the strike.

You can have a power stunt that has a higher cost/rank than the base power, but it has to equal the same amount of total points.

For example you could have rank 10 Energy Blast (2pp X 10ranks= 20pp)
w/a stunt
rank 5 Energy Blast w/the area and selective extras (4pp X 5ranks= 20pp)


http://www.mutantsandmasterminds.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=5358

 

[Insight]

You can have a power stunt that has a higher cost/rank than the base power, but it has to equal the same amount of total points.

For example you could have rank 10 Energy Blast (2pp X 10ranks= 20pp)
w/a stunt
rank 5 Energy Blast w/the area and selective extras (4pp X 5ranks= 20pp)


http://www.mutantsandmasterminds.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=5358

This is one of the few things I don't like about M&M. They keep changing things all the time. In the original rules (and hence my understanding of things), power stunts had to be based on the same cost/rank or less.

It's cool for the developer to answer fans' questions, etc, but it makes it awfully hard for someone to run a game when the rules keep changing from week to week or month to month.

 

[Thanee]

Heh. That's just in good tradition of the 3rd edition of D&D, I guess, where the FAQ constantly changes the rules and sometimes even message board posts by the designers. Altho, the "revised" version might be closer to the intent. I hope the revised rules cover all those little changes.

Anyways...

Thanks for the explanation. I understand, altho I don't really like it, because of the fixed cost, which is completely unrelated to what it adds.

Bye
Thanee