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<blockquote data-quote="Spatzimaus" data-source="post: 494614" data-attributes="member: 3051">What we use IMC is not so much an &quot;iron-clad&quot; DM fiat system as a &quot;research&quot;-style system.&nbsp; That is, the DMG items are absolute, and anything else requires DM's approval through the same sort of research new spells take.(Since we all DM each other at some point, that means the research works as long as we all agree it's more or less balanced)If you let the players make any item allowed by the DMG guidelines, you end up with no &quot;waste&quot;.&nbsp; The players end up making exactly the items they need without paying for any extras.&nbsp; In my experience this makes loot less important, as it'll conflict with one of their existing items while they could always create a similar item for a free slot.&nbsp; The items with the most &quot;character&quot; are the ones with extras the players might not use often.This doesn't mean I only stick to the DMG's lists, but it means I use the existing items as more of a guideline than those rules at the end of the chapter.&nbsp; For example, I LIKE that there are only certain slots that can be used for +STR items.&nbsp; For each stat I have a Greater and Lesser slot.&nbsp; Greater slots can have +2, +4, or +6 items, while the lesser slot caps at +4.&nbsp; For STR items, that means the belts are the Greater and gauntlets are the Lesser.&nbsp; Coincidentally, I use the same two slots reversed for DEX.&nbsp; Normally I wouldn't let a player put STR into an amulet, unless it really fit as part of some larger enchantment.It really comes down to DM's preference: do they view the DMG item lists as absolute and anything beyond that as something they need to approve, or are the custom item rules the baseline and the tables are just examples?&nbsp; I personally don't think you can just use the custom item rules and say that anything is allowed.&nbsp; As an example, someone once brought up a Sage ruling that referred to the &quot;quacks like a duck&quot; guideline about whether something should be a Wondrous Item or something more expensive.&nbsp; If it'd have a market price of over 30k, I'd be more likely to require it to be a Ring or Rod or something.If any effect can be added to any Wondrous items just by using the cost table in the DMG, what's the point of taking the Rod/Staff/Ring creation Feats?&nbsp; At some point you just have to say, &quot;no, stacking that many effects in one item isn't really appropriate for a Feat you got at level 3.&quot;&nbsp; Someone suggested splitting Craft Wondrous into three Feats (Minor, Medium, Major), and that's looking better and better.And we haven't got into the whole &quot;I want a cheap item that casts Cure Light Wounds or Magic Missile at will for 2k&quot; debate.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Spatzimaus, post: 494614, member: 3051"] What we use IMC is not so much an "iron-clad" DM fiat system as a "research"-style system. That is, the DMG items are absolute, and anything else requires DM's approval through the same sort of research new spells take. (Since we all DM each other at some point, that means the research works as long as we all agree it's more or less balanced) If you let the players make any item allowed by the DMG guidelines, you end up with no "waste". The players end up making exactly the items they need without paying for any extras. In my experience this makes loot less important, as it'll conflict with one of their existing items while they could always create a similar item for a free slot. The items with the most "character" are the ones with extras the players might not use often. This doesn't mean I only stick to the DMG's lists, but it means I use the existing items as more of a guideline than those rules at the end of the chapter. For example, I LIKE that there are only certain slots that can be used for +STR items. For each stat I have a Greater and Lesser slot. Greater slots can have +2, +4, or +6 items, while the lesser slot caps at +4. For STR items, that means the belts are the Greater and gauntlets are the Lesser. Coincidentally, I use the same two slots reversed for DEX. Normally I wouldn't let a player put STR into an amulet, unless it really fit as part of some larger enchantment. It really comes down to DM's preference: do they view the DMG item lists as absolute and anything beyond that as something they need to approve, or are the custom item rules the baseline and the tables are just examples? I personally don't think you can just use the custom item rules and say that anything is allowed. As an example, someone once brought up a Sage ruling that referred to the "quacks like a duck" guideline about whether something should be a Wondrous Item or something more expensive. If it'd have a market price of over 30k, I'd be more likely to require it to be a Ring or Rod or something. If any effect can be added to any Wondrous items just by using the cost table in the DMG, what's the point of taking the Rod/Staff/Ring creation Feats? At some point you just have to say, "no, stacking that many effects in one item isn't really appropriate for a Feat you got at level 3." Someone suggested splitting Craft Wondrous into three Feats (Minor, Medium, Major), and that's looking better and better. And we haven't got into the whole "I want a cheap item that casts Cure Light Wounds or Magic Missile at will for 2k" debate. [/QUOTE]

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