Magic: The Science and Art of Causing Change

[Pbartender]

Thanks, guys... I hope you find it, the review that is, useful.

I suggest you also put it in the review section of Enworld (if not already done).

93 Games Studio doesn't have a listing on the reviews page yet... As soon as figure out who the reviews moderators are, so they can add it, I will.

 

[Turanil]

As soon as figure out who the reviews moderators are, so they can add it, I will.

The easiest way is to ask Crothian, or to ask on the META forum. Then, a review mod will have to add the references for that publisher and after that you may post your review.

 

[smokewolf]

First off, I am the Keith Taylor who wrote Magic: The Science and Art of Causing Change.

Second, thanks for the kind words Pbartender. That is far better than what I expected someone to say about something of mine.

This product came about because of the lacking of D20 Modern to be able to accurately model "real" world magic styles; such as Wicca, Voodoo, etc. I have published two Arcane Classes (Wicca being one of them) and while am satisfied with the outcome it still wasn't what I hoped it would be. They are the best that could come out of D20 Modern though. If the FX system couldn't do it, then I had to come up with something else.

This new system is what I use in another game I wrote, The Swing. With a few tweaks it fit right into D20 Modern. Modern day magicians do not speak of character levels nor spell levels nor are they limited to a certain number of spells per day. This system allows for almost any possibility but it does not break the system to do. The examples I used are mostly D20 spells but I gave lots of references so that you can create a typical Wiccan's spellbook for example. I left "real" world examples out so as not to create some sort of artificial limitation on others to create their own. But it shouldn't be to hard to create a realistic Wiccan (or whatever you want) with this system.

I hope that add to Pbartender's already good overview. If anyone has any specific questions I am more than happy to answer them. So feel free to fire away with them.

 

[Pbartender]

Oh... something I forgot that bears mentioning.

I know that the rules were based off the D20 Modern SRD, and are geared toward that particular game, but it would have been nice to see some discussion on how the system would work with other D20 games. This is something that has, in general, been bothering me about 'house rule' supplements like this one...

Not just you, Keith, but most authors seem to forget about the modularity and variety of the D20 system. There are so many slight variations of the D20 rules for so many genres, and they are all compatable with each other to a degree. Those slight variations, however can make a big impact how many of the rules fit together. For example:

In Magic: The Science and Art of Causing Change one major drawback and limiting factor to casting rituals is the fact that the caster takes hit point damage every time he uses magic. Damage equal to the DC of the ritual. For even the most simple spells, that will be at least 8 or 9 points of damage when casting in combat. Playing D20 Modern this is less of a problem, since it is assumed that you cannot use magic until you have access to advanced classes after 4th level or so, and you have a significant pool of hitpoints accumulated. If you were to use this in any other D20 system, however, your typical 1st level caster would kill himself the first time he cast a spell.

A sidebar or two giving alternate suggestions for dealing with the damage in other systems would have been nice.

It also would have been nice to have a paragraph or two addressing how the system could be used in other genres. As I said in the review, if you shuck away the flavor text from the rules, the versatility of the system shows a lot of promise for sci-fi psionics, wuxia wire-fu, comic book superheroics, or any other super-human type of powers. Even without specifics, the very suggestion would broaden your audience.

My first thought reading through the PDF was, "This would be a great substitute for the crummy T20 psionics rules."

 

[sinmissing]

Not just you, Keith, but most authors seem to forget about the modularity and variety of the D20 system. There are so many slight variations of the D20 rules for so many genres, and they are all compatable with each other to a degree. Those slight variations, however can make a big impact how many of the rules fit together. For example:

Ok, but where do you draw the line? I'm not hear to defend Keith, mind you, but with so many d20 variants out there, you'll eventually be asking how to apply a d20 module to every other variant and end up with bloated page counts, which in turn raises the price. That's not a good alternative to me.

In Magic: The Science and Art of Causing Change one major drawback and limiting factor to casting rituals is the fact that the caster takes hit point damage every time he uses magic. Damage equal to the DC of the ritual. For even the most simple spells, that will be at least 8 or 9 points of damage when casting in combat. Playing D20 Modern this is less of a problem, since it is assumed that you cannot use magic until you have access to advanced classes after 4th level or so, and you have a significant pool of hitpoints accumulated. If you were to use this in any other D20 system, however, your typical 1st level caster would kill himself the first time he cast a spell.

I don't like that aspect either, but there are a number of simple fixes. Use spell points, fatigue, temporary ability damage, etc.

 

[smokewolf]

I understand Pbartender and plan to at least come out with a fantasy version. But also with sinmissing, without purchasing all of those books there is no way to write supplements that would work in those settings. However, if I were to want to use these rules in say, Conan, all I would do is raise or lower the DC modifiers to recognize the differences. I might also halve the damage taken from each spell for the caster. Little things should be all that is needed to transform this for any setting.

As for the damage each spell causes the caster; HP's are considered not only to be wounds but includes fatigue, stamina and toughness all in one. As spells are described that they drain energy away from a spell caster; and in some settings they speak of spell casting as a tiring activity. To create a fatigue or spell point system seemed redundant. Plus there are examples (more so in novels) of spells being cast so powerful they kill the caster. Both of these activities are modeled with the damage the caster takes. I do realise some people may not like that, but if you want giving the caster a spell point (or mana) pool equal to the current HP (physical damage a caster takes should drain them as well) that they use to cast spells from would work without making them too powerful. Remember in this system a first level guy might be able to cast a 10D6 fireball. They way its setup now, it would must certainly kill him, without limiting factors such as HP damage, this could be abused.

But I do encourage peolpe to use this system as they see fit. I have had one guy already make several rules additions for his homebrew setting. I would love to hear how other people are using this system, so drop me line if you are doing something special with it.

smokewolf @ 93gamesstudio.com (minus the spaces)

 

[Pbartender]

The review is formally posted.

But I do encourage peolpe to use this system as they see fit. I have had one guy already make several rules additions for his homebrew setting. I would love to hear how other people are using this system, so drop me line if you are doing something special with it.

smokewolf @ 93gamesstudio.com (minus the spaces)

Slick. I'm actually considering writing up a variation on the system for use as a psionics in Sci-fi type settings. I'll send you a copy, if I ever get it finished.

 

[sinmissing]

I've been toying with this system, and while I like the concept, I find that too many spells end up in the same DC range, leaving little variation between spells of different levels. Maybe I'm over thinking the implications.

 

[smokewolf]

There isn't really that much difference between one effect to the next except as one increases its power. The difficulty isn't in the effect that is produced per sea, it's in the effective power of the effect.

1 point of damage is no different than 1 point of attribute increase

The only real difference would be in the mind of the uninitiated. Remember Yoda's speak to Luke about the XWing?

The real difference in this system is the ability to combine and create. If you want to use SRD spells, there is not going to be much difference between them. But what about combining Magic Missile with Ray of Fatigue, so not only do they take damage but they are fatigued as well, or any number of variations there in.

If you can suffer the damage, the is no limit to what you can do, there is no need to wait 5 turn to do five different spells. Do them all in one shot, if you dare.

 

[HalWhitewyrm]

I purchased this as research material (yeah, that's it, research material) for something we are working on, and love it. The beauty is not in replicating the SRD spells, though it works fine for that (and as an aside, I love that the result is that some low-level, high-effect spells get balanced out for what they do, like magic missile or true strike), but when you start creating on-the-fly magical effects and combining old favorites into big magical broo-ha-haas that can make a target suffer damage, become fatigued, fall asleep, lose Con points and have nightmares all at the same time.