Making DnDN Popular

[Mallus]

D&D is the single most identifiable brand in role-playing gaming. It's likely the only game people outside the hobby can name. Also, it's currently played most by a middle-aged, professional --ie pretty well-off-- demographic.

The core rules will not be free.

Nor should they be -- gamers are a market that can pay.

Should there be the regular release of free WotC materials? Sure (if they're smart). Should there be some kind of D&D Next SRD? I sure hope so.

Will all the core rules be freely available? I doubt it.

 

[Ultimatecalibur]

I agree that the core will not be free, but then the modules should be. The people shouldn't have to pay more than once for what is in essence a single game. Or make the cost of modules minimal. Otherwise, people will stop buying D&D because it's just 'marketing same thing several times to get money'.

How a module gets priced and published should be determined by its individual size and scope. A module made up of 100 hireling personalities makes an effective Dragon Magazine article or online bonus, while a module containing the rules for building and maintaining a variety strongholds should get its own standalone book or possibly a boxed set that combines it with the mass combat rules module.

 

[kitsune9]

They did that for Beta to promote further playtesting, however for the Core Rulebook, the PDF is $10. The same with their Beginner Box. Wizards can release the playtesting drafts for free or sell a "Beta book", but I'm not sure that an all-out free Core set is viable in the long-run. Free can generate you interest, but the Law of Diminishing Returns can quickly turn your business model to mush.

 

[Dannager]

Actually, I'd say one of the things going for Pathfinder in the early days is that, by and large, everyone already had a copy of the rules. Giving the system away for free certainly helped, but I think what helped a lot more was that the core of the system was essentially something that everyone was already familiar with.

 

[DonTadow]

Actually, I'd say one of the things going for Pathfinder in the early days is that, by and large, everyone already had a copy of the rules. Giving the system away for free certainly helped, but I think what helped a lot more was that the core of the system was essentially something that everyone was already familiar with.

Releasing an online SRD yes, giving a book away for free, i doubt. It's poor business for a large company. Paizo is smaller, and needed the momentum. 5e does not need the momentum. Hasbro has invested a lot in 5e. They have a dozen other divisions. They expect the same types of results. The product has to be able to hold up on its own without marketing gimicks and sell well. The hope is that they never produce a book that costs more than 10 or 15 bucks. I think they can do a softcover version of the book and get away with it, because they know they'll be able to sell that printrun.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

The free PDF corebook is a good idea...until e-readers become the normal way for people to read books (aka 5-10 years). But its a good idea for 2013.

4e failed because WotC did not market the game aggressively to new players. Their hope with the open beta is that they will get a bunch of free marketing via word of mouth. Of course, the word of mouth will only be from existing gamer to existing gamer.

WotC forgets that teens and young adults who have a FAR stronger word of mouth chain than adults. Kids network to a greater extent because of the crucible of a shared school. Adults don't share much at work because of the perceived social concerns of being a TTRPG gamer.

Yes I know you tell everyone at work that you play D&D, but you may be surprised that's uncommon among gamers.

So the result will be the same whether 5e is awesome or not. It will fail utterly without a huge advertising and marketing push to draw in teens and young adults.

No fresh blood = failed edition

It seems like they are doing it right this time:

A forgotten realms novel, ADnD 1st edition reprints, Articles in non-gaming related magazines, a open playtest, which more or less means, you get the rules for free... not closing 4e.

 

[Wormwood]

For every 4E player that makes the leap to 5E, there will be one who makes the leap to Pathfinder.

[citation needed]

For that premise to make sense, 5e would not only have to be *radically* different from 4e, but it would have to be different in a way almost calculated to offend 4e fans.

Because that's the only scenario that I can see resulting in 4e players abandoning a game they (presumably) enjoy and run over to Paizo to pick up a game that they (presumably) don't.

Not that it matters to me---a huge 4e fan---because if I decide to end my 4e game and not play 5th, it would never even occur to me to play Pathfinder (a fine game, but not one to my tastes).

 

[OnlineDM]

For every 4E player that makes the leap to 5E, there will be one who makes the leap to Pathfinder.

Speaking as a 4e player, I doubt this. Depending on how good 5e is, I could see a true statement being, "For every 4e player that makes the leap to 5e, there will be one who stays with 4e."

If I were a 4e player who preferred Pathfinder, I'd already be playing Pathfinder. I have nothing against the system, but I've had more fun with 4e. If WotC brought out a 5e that I hated (which I doubt will be the case), I'd just stick with 4e.

 

[Li Shenron]

...

That said. I think Wizards could learn another lesson that would be of great value to them.

1) Give away the digital base rulebook. (Physical should be made at cost).
2) Make money on all the rest.

...

I think releasing the 3ed SRD to the public domain was pretty much identical...

If you want to play the game, all you really need is the rules. You don't need the artwork, the verbose explanations or examples, and you don't need the "trademark" monsters like illithids, the game is fully playable with a SRD. That's pretty good if you ask me! If am not sure I like the game, I really appreciate to have that chance.

Probably a beginner would have a harder time learning the game from the SRD, but also a digital copy IMHO it wouldn't be as effective as a fully physical book. At least for me... I hate reading from a screen

 

[Gronin]

I've DM'ed for a long time. And there's *always* *always* some guy who comes around with the pirated, printed out "versions" of the rulebooks. Not much I or Wizards are going to be able to do to stop such players other than make stabby eyes at them.

The word free is a magic word. Grab it and use it to your advantage. Make the core system simple, make it well, and then make it free. And the players will *flock* back to DnDN.

Instead of making stabby eyes at them you can tell them they are not welcome at your table. I have done this and it doesn't always make me popular. In order to support our industry we need to police it ourselves unless we thnk we will like the results that we get when others police it for us.

I'm going to get off my soap box now and get on to your next point.

Free is also a word that can set the perceived value of an item. We have all heard the expression "You get what you pay for." Free starter rules are one thing but giving away the entire core ruleset is not something I would expect to see from a company that (like all companies) is in business to make money.


Fair warning it turns out I'm not done with the soapbox......

I have no problem paying to support a hobby that has kept me entertained for 35 years. I expect to pay for the core books and I expect to pay for any supplements and/or modules that I may want. I also am quite fine with paying for any online support that may exist, however, I expect value for my money. I expect to get what I am told I am going to get. It is in this area that 4E feel flat on its face.

I will be upfront in saying that I have enjoyed every edition that has been published to date and have generally followed the path that TSR/WOTC/Hasbro has laid out for me. That being said 4E left a very bad taste in my mouth and it wasn't the game itself --- it was in the area of electronic support.

DDI has been an unmitigated disaster. The character generator has been buggy (although to be fair that has improved) and the rest of what was promised has never really materialized at the expected (and promised) level. Even Dungeon and Dragon magazines have begun to disappoint (not from a content level - it would be unfair to expect every article to be useful to my specific needs) but rather form a delivery standpoint. When DDI began I was able to download entire issues at the end of the month -- this has since been changed so that only individual articles can be downloaded. The Adventure Tools are incomplete, the Virtual Tabletop has never made it past the playtest level, the list goes on. In short I have paid for things that were promised to me but never received.

Customer support when there are issues has also been an issue. It should not be a difficult process to discuss a legitimate problem with a company. If a company makes it difficult to complain there is a perception (real or imagined) that they do not want to hear about any issues you may have.

I run my own business and I can guarantee that if I ran my business under this model I would be looking for a job.

I guess what I am saying is that customer service is at the heart of any good business model and WOTC has not shown me that they believe this. I am very interested in seeing where the next iteration of D&D is going to take us but in order for me to continue down this road I need to see a change in the current service model.

WOW -- didn't realize how bitter I was about all of that.