Marketing: How would you have done it?

[Rechan]

Well, first off, designers are not marketers.

Hey, I understand that. But someone chose to have the designers do the marketing.

This is just "Okay, you think you're better, and you have the material, how would you have done it if you were in their shoes?"

Many of these examples though are really outside of the designers hands, but not necessarily out of Bill's hands.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Before I go any further, I must say I agree with several of your points on the marketing...

This means that they were essentially appealing to the gamer elite that follow it obsessively online (like all of us) and then hope that word trickles down to the players and groups everywhere.

Speak for yourself- once any text product goes purely digital, I drop it, unless it is required for me to do my work. Dragon and Dungeon, like Pyramid before it, effectively ceased to exist for me when they went online exclusively.

In fact, I keep hearing all of these problems with the way 4E was marketed, yet it seems to be selling pretty well.

Its a maxim of marketing that the strongest predictor of success in the marketplace is making it to market first- 30-odd years ago, that was accomplished by EGG and his buddies product, Dungeons & Dragons.

The name "D&D" (and its variants) alone grants it unequaled name recognition a head-start in sales over any other game in the RPG niche...and lets face it, its following hard on the heels of a great success story called 3Ed.

They often say that a competent DA can get a jury to indict a ham sandwich. Similarly, with all of the positive marketing factors associated with just the name D&D, a dead monkey could have been in charge of marketing and still made sales in excess of any other RPG in the market.

Simply put, "D&D" was going to sell big based on sight-unseen pre-orders alone.

 

[Darrin Drader]

Hey, I understand that. But someone chose to have the designers do the marketing.

True, but the point is that if the designers managed to market poorly, it might be because they're designers and their job is to write rules, not present the company's best face to the public. Overall, I don't think they did too poor of a job of it.

Its a maxim of marketing that the strongest predictor of success in the marketplace is making it to market first- 30-odd years ago, that was accomplished by EGG and his buddies product, Dungeons & Dragons.

The name "D&D" (and its variants) alone grants it unequaled name recognition a head-start in sales over any other game in the RPG niche...and lets face it, its following hard on the heels of a great success story called 3Ed.

They often say that a competent DA can get a jury to indict a ham sandwich. Similarly, with all of the positive marketing factors associated with just the name D&D, a dead monkey could have been in charge of marketing and still made sales in excess of any other RPG in the market.

Simply put, "D&D" was going to sell big based on sight-unseen pre-orders alone.

I agree. With the D&D brand name, all they needed to do was phone it in. As long as people knew that a new version of the rules was about to drop, did they really need to go to the same trouble they did with 3rd edition? 3E came at a time when the brand was in serious need of revitalization and they did manage to bring it back from the brink. 4th edition came at a time when 3E was near the end of its life cycle, but large numbers of players didn't seem to have lapsed like they did with 2E.

If the marketing would have been better, maybe more of us existing elite fans would have been a little more excited to see it. As it was, I felt that it came a little too soon, and felt like all the books on my shelf that would never get used would be a waste if I chose to adopt the new rules.

But as I said before, I don't feel as though they completely botched it either.

 

[Fenes]

Overuse of the word "cool" is a serious complaint for me, and which I would have done differently. It may be wishful thinking, but talking to your customers as if they were adults instead of trying to use teenage lingo would be something I'd do.

 

[FalcWP]

First off, I wouldn't have tied 4th Edition with the DDI. That's two brand new things, and if either one flops, it reflects poorly on the other. DDI got a lot of criticism because of the decision to kill Dragon and Dungeon, and that that bled over onto 4th Edition. Also, how many people did you hear say, 'I won't play 4th Edition because now you need to play it on the computer'? I lost track. DDI and 4th Edition got linked in a lot of minds, and it didn't help matters at all.

Second... while ponying up for Colbert and Wheaton might make some sense, the number one guy to get on board for 4E as a spokesperson would have been Vin Diesel. Number of reasons for this. First off, Colbert, Wheaton, Patton Oswalt, and Brian Posehn all fit the 'D&D Geek Stereotype'. To put it bluntly, they're white nerds, which is how D&D players are commonly portrayed. Vin Diesel, obviously, is not.

If they really wanted to spend some cash, your best bet might be to get all five of those guys. Show the 'nerds' first, then bring in Vin Diesel to DM. A bit silly, sure. Probably get some groans from players and non-players alike. But it'd make an impression.

Another thing I'd do for a commercial would be something like what Direct TV has done recently - take a popular movie and substitute in some scenes or dialog to promote the product. Direct TV has used Major League and Back to the Future for this.

A D&D version might take, say, Lord of the Rings. Take, oh... the fight in Moria with the cave troll. Show a few seconds of it, then stop the action - either pause it with the image frozen on the screen, or cut to a view of a D&D game - with a player asking if he can, oh, jump on top of the troll and fire an arrow into it. DM calls for a skill check or a die roll, player rolls. Then, the scene resumes, and we see Legolas jump on the troll and fire an arrow into its head. Fade to black as the DM says 'Ok. And now it's the cave troll's turn...', show the 4th Edition logo.

You could certainly put that on TV - I'd focus on stations like Comedy Central and Cartoon Network. It might also be viable to look at setting it up as a viral marketing campaign - put it on YouTube and just start sending out links.

I'd also advertise it before any relevant movie around the time of release. Take the same formula as above, get some advance footage of the movie that's about to be shown... and run it right before the movie. Indiana Jones and The Chronicles of Narnia would both have been great for this (yes, even though Indy isn't a high fantasy swords and sorcery adventure, the feel is right).

This could work particularly well if you created something for a quick-play module that ties in to the movie in question. Provide some basic rules, pre-gen characters, and a scenario to run through. Nothing terribly long or involved, but enough to get people interested (either non-gamers or D&D players who weren't sure about 4E). Offer a discount to anyone who turns in a movie ticket stub when they purchase the adventure.

Just a few things I might have done.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I like your movie ideas- definitely has a "Whats Up, Tiger Lilly" vibe- but licensing those movie clips would have been PRICEY!

Using the same tactic with lesser known fantasy movies- good, bad and indifferent- would have worked just about as well.

Heck, they could have even used the old D&D movies

Or the old series!

Ok, maybe not the old series- Bobby the Barbarian would have to be edited out...

 

[Darrin Drader]

Using the same tactic with lesser known fantasy movies- good, bad and indifferent- would have worked just about as well.

How about a movie that should be nice and cheap these days, like Conan the Barbarian?

Of course they could have also used In the Name of the King: A Dungeon Siege Tale.

What?

 

[Tervin]

WotC are very good at marketing... Magic. So why not try some of their tricks?

Examples:

Weeks after the initial announcement they could have had polls up where fans get to vote to save their creature - that way getting a sneak peek at what will get into the MM, and also feel that the designers actually listened to them.

Later on they could have had similar polls asking which classes and races that aren't making the first PH are most important to get to see as soon as possible.

And right about now they could ask us which so far unused power sources we are most interested in, and even hold a contest as for inventing a new power source, including a few classes and powers to show off what it would be about.

For more simple audience participation - why not "make your own power/feat/monster"-competitions where they would show a few samples just to whet our appetites.

As for things not to do:
'In 3rd edition this thing X is just so bad. Don't you all hate that? *laugh* That is why we made X into a Y now and it is much sexier.' (aggravates X-lovers and feels cheap to many others)
'Ok X has been in the game from the beginning. But nobody really understood it anyway so we are taking it out of the game.'
(makes them look stupid to all those who feel that X is something that they understood and loved about the game)
Publish preview adverts in the form of books and ask people to pay for them.
Remake the website into something uglier and more confusing where visitors have to work to see what has actually updated the last day.
Promise that things are going to be ready by a certain date, and then not deliver.
Allow information that is no longer true to be accessible from the website.

I think 4th edition is really good. I think that some of the marketing of it is really good too. And I am really glad that it is selling so well so far despite all the bullets they have put into their own feet.

 

[Darrin Drader]

'In 3rd edition this thing X is just so bad. Don't you all hate that? *laugh* That is why we made X into a Y now and it is much sexier.' (aggravates X-lovers and feels cheap to many others)

OK, seriously, did anyone really like grappling in 3.x?

 

[Tervin]

Or...

Just use some of this.

And perhaps add a little thingy to tell people how they are keeping the cool stuff from back then while making it feel current and run smoother.