Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Soulknife_Infiltrator" data-source="post: 9370737" data-attributes="member: 7040881">That might be correct in 5e. But what the 5e2024 Rogue has been facing that too many classes are having similar features, good mobility, good skills, better damage, which make Rogue lacks a core feature that really make them "special" enough.It's more like "Why would I play Rogue instead of other Martials that could do similar things, maybe even better" for many players. Though I know there's still gonna be hell lot of players, including myself, are going to continue to play and love this class without grumbling. But that doesn't mean Rogue should just stay as what it is when we see there's a obvious weakpoint of "not being better at anything".When a class can't contriube anything special and unique enough, many players are gonna find it frustrating and even boring to play, due to the designing of the class. Though, let me put this first: Of coure it still could be fun as hell if you're having a great table and story, but we're gonna discuss it the class designing itself, without considering the pure Role-Playing part, since players can't always have the suitable game.Back to the topic, Fighter always feel unique and strong enough for players even though they share the same Fighting Styles, Extra Attacks, and now Weapon Masteries with other classes, just because the famous and powerful feature Action Surge stands there tall and tell the players "Hey! Nobody can fight like me".But Rogue...Well, Rogue, after UA7 and UA8, Rogue's combat toolkit, like Cunning Action and Uncanny Dodge have been almost fully replicated by Monk, while they even have a better version of Uncanny Dogde--Deflect Attacks.Evasion, also shared by Monk, and the Hunter Ranger.Sneak Attack, it's cool, and it should be Rogue's one and only feature that shines so bright, but sadly it's been so much worse than the normal Extra Attacks. It's harder to land, benefit less from Magic Weapons, feels so frustrated when you miss. Even when you didn't miss, it's still dealing sorry damage than characters with Extra Attacks. Cunning Strike is helping, but it costs even more damage above that, while half of the effects could be simply replicated by Weapon Masteries that only Rogue can't perform, while other Martials could do it twice.So finally, we're back to Skills. Skills were the only reason for Rogue to "contribute so less in a combat* during 5e. But now it should definitely not be the reason. They are only a bit better than other Martials at skills before 7, while they might be even worse with critical checks. Especially when Expertise was shared by Ranger and Bard orginally, and now many Full Casters are also having a taste of that.Rogue's Skills are definitely not enough to be that one and only feature that makes players feel "hey I can't play the game like in a Rogue way if I choose another class". In fact, Rogue might be the simplest Class to be replicated with the same flavor and similar features now. More importantly, the Skill System itself just can't afford that uniqueness.Actually, Rangers have been facing similar problems either. They both lack of a defining feature that makes players feel powerful and unique enough. But Rangers still have a good toolkit, power-wise, like Expertise, Spells, Rituals, Martial Weapons, Shield Prof, Fighting Styles etc. But Rogues don't have any of those powerful options. Rogue needs some kind of boost to create a defining feature for the class.</blockquote>

Verification