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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 9374893" data-attributes="member: 6801228">That's fair, but I think this is more a reflection of the standards. When I'm demanded to show a level 13 rogue can solo a CR 17 Adult Red Dragon... I optimize. I think the rogue does perfectly fine with a Rapier, and with Nick the dual-wielding is very good (most of the rogue's I have attempted to playtest have been dual-wielding with nick. Feels nice), but that is just like the sword and board fighter is perfectly fine.I am not against a better skill system that will give cool new toys to martials. I've even proposed such a system at least twice. I've also specifically tried to avoid having that system be combat focused, because I've mainly proposed it for fighters who much more desperately need out-of-combat utility. And there are useful things you could do for a rogue, by letting their expertise unlock special perks, or by having a second, higher DC that allows for an essential "critical success" on a skill check. Off the top of my head something like rolling high enough on sleight of hand allowing the rogue to not only unlock a door, but get a full rundown on what is in the room beyond. I'm not sure what balance of "GM fiat" and "designed system" is best for that though.Because it is bad game design. Back-tracking sucks, back-tracking because because the DM designed something to specifically give you no way of getting to it except to back-track gets players murderous. I still remember fuming at a DM from over a decade ago in 4e. We were high level in Darksun, given a mission by a sorcerer-king (long story) and said "we would leave immediately". The DM gave us a few days of travel, then said we were out of supplies. Why? Because despite knowing the desert, despite knowing it was a month-long trek across the desert, because we said "leave immediately" he ruled that we did not go and buy any supplies. We had to cheat and use rituals and burn gold to get back to the city to buy the supplies that NONE of our characters would have forgotten. You always need to have multiple solutions to any given issue, because once you force players to turn around and go back to town to get things that they either A) had no idea they needed or B) would have obviously gotten, all you are doing is annoying them for no reason.</blockquote>

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