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<blockquote data-quote="raleel" data-source="post: 7069249" data-attributes="member: 21664">It really depends a lot on the environment, in my mind. Without patrolling monsters in the area or some other time derived challenge, time based penalties are going to be irrelevant, and thus retrying will be a thing that will be desired and no rational reason can be made for it not to happen. This is what happens in current crime, where if a lock cannot be picked quickly or safely, but the locked item can be taken quickly and safely, they'll just take the locked item and unlock it with time and safety. I like to have a failure mode that involves an alternative path towards the goal, but is perhaps riskier, or involves a different set of skills. This is equivalent in some ways to a reroll, but rather than having the thief just roll again, you switch it up a bit. perhaps the alternative leads through monsters. Perhaps it requires investigation and there is a secret door that bypasses the lock. A great little game I picked up called Black Seven puts picking locks (called crack, as it covers a number of lock like mechanisms, including electronic ones) into a category called Positioning Actions. If you fail a positioning action, you make an immediate Infiltration (aka stealth) roll. If you fail that, you are Noticed by the opposition in the facility, and they are on alert. It is much harder to sneak up on folks and take them out. This suggests to me that failure might mean a Stealth check. Failing that alerts the monsters that someone is around.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="raleel, post: 7069249, member: 21664"] It really depends a lot on the environment, in my mind. Without patrolling monsters in the area or some other time derived challenge, time based penalties are going to be irrelevant, and thus retrying will be a thing that will be desired and no rational reason can be made for it not to happen. This is what happens in current crime, where if a lock cannot be picked quickly or safely, but the locked item can be taken quickly and safely, they'll just take the locked item and unlock it with time and safety. I like to have a failure mode that involves an alternative path towards the goal, but is perhaps riskier, or involves a different set of skills. This is equivalent in some ways to a reroll, but rather than having the thief just roll again, you switch it up a bit. perhaps the alternative leads through monsters. Perhaps it requires investigation and there is a secret door that bypasses the lock. A great little game I picked up called Black Seven puts picking locks (called crack, as it covers a number of lock like mechanisms, including electronic ones) into a category called Positioning Actions. If you fail a positioning action, you make an immediate Infiltration (aka stealth) roll. If you fail that, you are Noticed by the opposition in the facility, and they are on alert. It is much harder to sneak up on folks and take them out. This suggests to me that failure might mean a Stealth check. Failing that alerts the monsters that someone is around. [/QUOTE]

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