Military tactics vs. high-level spellcasters

[painandgreed]

I think there is enough support thrown at the wizards where I won't go into how they would defend said castle. Really, merely summoning a few monsters that require at least a +1 magical weapon to injure would be enough to rout the larger army. But I digress..

Most summoning spells only last for a number of rounds equal to caster level. Hardly enough time to do much to a large group of men like an army. If they are properly disciplined and trained, threatened troops could probably simply flee such creatures till they are gone.

 

[Salthorae]

I think everyone has forgotten the biggest "Wizard Bane" there is... what is the best way to negate the ability of wizards to effect your 10k troops? Outfit every 1 in 10 or 20 or 50 troops with an item that generates an Antimagic Field, or if you have enough troops with UMD, outfit them with scrolls instead...

No spells in or out, not even Dispel Magic works in the AMF. Wizards that fly too low find themselves falling among angry troops... the best hope the wizards would have would be Summoned Creatures that have an SR to allow them to still remain in the AoE for the Antimagic Field.

It may be on the expensive side (132k/item for continuous effect or 79.2k for 3/day), but it's the easiest most effective way to turn the battle into 10k vs 500 troops rather than 10k vs 500+20 mid to high wizards..

 

[Joshua Randall]

One thing the army can do to improve its odds: attack multiple times throughout the day with < 8 hour intervals between each attack. Keep the pressure on so the defending wizards can't rest, or so they wizards have to split themselves up into shifts (thereby diluting their combined spellpower).

If the entire army attacks every day at dawn when all the wizards have full spell allotments, forget it. If, say, 1/6 of the army attacks every 4 hours... then maybe they have a chance.

Maybe.

 

[Morrus]

It may be on the expensive side (132k/item for continuous effect or 79.2k for 3/day), but it's the easiest most effective way to turn the battle into 10k vs 500 troops rather than 10k vs 500+20 mid to high wizards..

Well, that's really the point. Given infinite resources, any army can bring anything they need to bear on the opponenets, be that more troops, monsters, equipment, spellcasters, what-have-you.

With that sort of money, the attackers could increase their army to 10 times the size. They haven't done that, presumably because they can't.

 

[Salthorae]

Also, let's give the army a chance to recruit some allies. What would they want to get? Monsters, high-level spellcasters, devils?

Sorry I was going off of RangerWickett's post above. If they are recruiting, my assumption is they have some way to compensate their new allies. Also, aside from a cool castle, the army probably isn't coming away with a lot of Swag from this crusade, so my other assumption was that the army isn't a mercenary one, but motivated in some other way (which would then leave room for new fun AMF items! yay! )

That may not be the case however, in which case your point definitely superceeds my idea...

 

[Kid Charlemagne]

First - define mid to high level, and roughly how many of each: 20 wizards might be vulnerable if the attacking force can lure them out of the castle by offering what seems like a prime target. Trick them into an ambush - wizards are overconfident in their mental superiority. You don;t have to get them all, just wear them down bit by bit.

To avoid the invisible wizard scry-teleport, use lots of dogs with scent as sentry animals to sniff out bad guys.

For allies, you'd want any kind of things that can see invisible. See invisible and grapple would be really cool. Wands of dimensional anchor, etc.

The attacking army must have some magical counterpunch of its own - it would be unreasonable to assume they have nothing magical to counter the wizards. Clerics? A few of their own wizards? Every little bit will help.

Means of tunnelling under the castle walls would be good.

 

[Felix]

Say you've got an army of 10,000 men, most of them 4th level or less. And you want to sack a fortress that has 20 mid- to high-level spellcasters and say 500 soldiers. The fortress is on a peninsula, has high ground, and is the size of a small castle, with a surrounding town. It will take the army a month to arrive.

Enemy spellcasters will be directing salvo after salvo of Fireballs at your massed troops. So you can't mass troops.

I'd recommend keeping a large body of troops poised outside the mage's territory secured in a defensive formation (so they seem to present less of a threat) and begin to invest the countryside with your agents. There's a town outside? Plenty of places to hide: start buying property. Incite the population to riot via poisoning, strange deeds done in the night, babies-stolen-to-sacrifice-to-profane-gods. That sort of thing will make the residents much more sympathetic to your anti-caster cause.

If at all possible, insert agents into their heirarchy to gather information. A nice adventure would mirror "The Departed" with the PCs as moles trying to figure out who in their camp is a mole for the enemy. These moles would attempt assassination, sabotage and theft.

When the 20 casters and 500 guards have thier hands filled with a ritous population, missing vital equipment, poisoned food and water, and broken draw-bridges, it will be a much more peaceful march accross the pennensula for your 10,000 troops.

 

[Schmoe]

Also, let's give the army a chance to recruit some allies. What would they want to get? Monsters, high-level spellcasters, devils?

Giants. Spread the giants out so that no more than one is caught in any AOE. Even 20 casters can't do enough damage to take out 100 stone giants, unless they are very high level. The giants can break a hole in the wall from range with their boulders.

A wizard-slaying company. Perhaps 40 strong Rogue 2/Fighter 2, mounted on griffons (or yrtthaks!), with potions of See Invisibility and magic arrows. If they deploy and skirmish in groups 5 or so, they will keep the wizards occupied to the point where the wizards are too busy to do any real damage to the actual army.

Dragons. Nothing says "I hate wizards" like a flying, fire-breathing, blind-seeing, spell-resistant monster.

Devils. A flock of Erinyes would be murder for the wizards to deal with. True Sight, flight, deadly ranged attacks, and hefty resistances.

Maybe a mercenary group of Xorns to undermine the walls.

A couple of well-paid and very experienced assassins to infiltrate the fortress prior to the assault. Give the assassin some very deadly poisons for maximum effect.

A covey of hags would be extremely effective. They can use Control Weather to create a storm. Flying wizards aren't very effective with high winds and low visibility. They can use Veil to disguise a crack squad of troops as fleeing refugees. They can use Mirage Arcana to create thick underbrush for hiding troops. And they can Forcecage any wizard who does come in range.

 

[kigmatzomat]

The real question is: what does the attacking commander want? Does he want the wizards dead? Humiliated? The army destroyed? The McGuffin under the castle? Declare himself Duke? Is this a stepping stone to a larger military agenda?

You need a properly defined goal (strategy) before you start talking operations (tactics).

Different goals have different approaches and failing to recognize that will spell disaster.

 

[Salthorae]

You need a properly defined goal (strategy) before you start talking operations (tactics).

Different goals have different approaches and failing to recognize that will spell disaster.

Very good point! What's my motivation here people?