minis and battlemats or not?

do you prefer to play with miniatures and battlemats or not?

  • i prefer to play with miniatures and battlemats.

    Votes: 87 82.9%
  • i prefer to play without miniatures and battlemats.

    Votes: 18 17.1%

I knew several DMs who liked the deliberate "vagueness" of playing without minis and mats. Some would even roll dice to randomly determine which enemy was nearest to a particular player, whenever a player asked.

Yeah, vagueness in combat seemed a lot more common before 3E. I think that it's a valid play style in and of itself, but some DMs do it well and some don't. Like the 2E game I played in 2002 where the DM tracked character hit points for us...

We were investigating a thieves' guild in a major city and got into a classic street chase scene. We followed a thief into "a very narrow alley," it was so narrow that we had to go in single file. When we asked how wide the alley was, the DM responded that medieval people don't carry rulers or tape measures with them, or for that matter, people in real life don't either, and that the important thing was that we had to go in single-file. So I'm imagining it's somewhere in the three to four-foot wide range. But alas, tape measures don't appear on the equipment lists of the Player's Handbook, so we get the pleasure of not having a mat interfere with our imaginations.

When combat breaks out, I think that I'm going to stand behind the fighter and heal him, and he'll be able to block off the alley. Suddenly, this "very narrow alley" was wide enough for the guild thugs to get past the fighter and attack the rest of the party. We call the DM on the evocative narrowness of this alley, to which he responds, "narrow is a relative term, what is narrow to an ox cart isn't necessarily narrow to a housecat." So although we had to file in single-file, the alley is wide enough for thugs to get past the fighter unchallenged and attack the squishier members of our party, and also to gang up on the fighter three-to-one.

That suddenly made me appreciate attacks of opportunity and want to go back to 3E.

I was playing the cleric, and it was therefore pretty important to me to know how banged up the characters were. When I'd ask about the fighter, he'd say something like, "He's fine," "he's getting winded but doesn't have any obvious wounds," "he has a few shallow nicks and scratches but isn't bleeding, nothing serious." Then BAM! The fighter is dead because he ran out of hit points. It was a major pain to know when to heal people, because this "narrative damage" system meant that no wounds looked serious until it was the one that killed you (and he didn't use the "hovering on death's door" rule, you were dead at 0 hit points).

But really, those are tales of DM vagueness moreso than minis and mats, so I'll stop there.

I think that the real advantage to having miniatures and mats is that players are all on the same page. The wizard doesn't have to ask the DM how many of the orcs he can catch in his fireball. The fighter doesn't have to ask if he can interpose himself between the orc chieftan and his wizard buddy. The rogue doesn't have to ask if there's cover to hide behind. The ranger doesn't have to ask if there's something blocking his shot at the orc chieftan. Once my groups started using minis and mats, I noticed that everyone knew what they wanted to do when their turn came up. Getting a round-by-round update from the DM gets cumbersome after a while.
 

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I think that the real advantage to having miniatures and mats is that players are all on the same page. The wizard doesn't have to ask the DM how many of the orcs he can catch in his fireball. The fighter doesn't have to ask if he can interpose himself between the orc chieftan and his wizard buddy. The rogue doesn't have to ask if there's cover to hide behind. The ranger doesn't have to ask if there's something blocking his shot at the orc chieftan. Once my groups started using minis and mats, I noticed that everyone knew what they wanted to do when their turn came up. Getting a round-by-round update from the DM gets cumbersome after a while.

This has been my experience too.

Even using a simple set of rules such as basic set D&D, combat encounters can be stretched quite significantly from players constantly asking the DM these sorts of questions and/or arguing with the DM. Due to this arguing and asking tons of questions + looking up several tables, I do remember combat encounters in 1E AD&D being stretched to as long as the high level combat encounters in 3.5E using minis (ie. from all the bookkeeping and other stuff). This stretching of the combat encounter times is due to entirely different things.

Without turning this into an edition war, 4E D&D did feel like a breath of fresh air in comparison to all these sorts of problems in earlier editions which stretched combat encounter times significantly. Though 4E did introduce its own stretching of combat encounter times, by significantly hiking up the number of hit points for both players and monsters. How I've dealt with this problem is to add a bonus of +level to the damage rolls. (Star War Saga Edition does something like this, but only a +level/2 bonus to the damage from melee and ranged attacks). This does actually make the combat encounters move faster, and doesn't have that "is this over yet" type of fatigue from combat times being stretched out.
 
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allo

for those who have gamed using miniatures and battlemats, do you prefer to play that way? or do you like to do it all in your head?

the reason i ask is that i'm wondering if use of minis and battlemats gets in the way of using one's imagination to picture the events in the game.

messy

I definitely have been using minis and battlemats since 1st ed. I have rarely played any other way.
 

Nah, keep me away from minis & battleboards -- I strongly dislike the "False God's Eye View" of minis. They cause as many arguments as they sort out and the limit options to what is on hand.

Personally, I'll take the mind over the board.
 

Been using them since I started in '81. I've always seen it as part of the game. And everyone I've ever gamed with outside my own sphere of influence uses them, happily for me (and shockingly, too, considering the results of the poll). Viva la minis!
 


Nah, keep me away from minis & battleboards -- I strongly dislike the "False God's Eye View" of minis. They cause as many arguments as they sort out and the limit options to what is on hand.

...how? :erm: I cannot fathom how using rigid, point-of-reference material would bring in any where near as many problems as it solves. As mentioned above, it clarifies where enemies are, how a fighter can get in between danger and his squishy friends, where to aim spells to hit enemies and not allies, and just where you need to be to flank, hide, or charge someone.

What arguments does it bring in?
 

I don't like minis and battlegrids. I do, however, always use some kind of visual representation of the battlefield in D&D games. I tend to either use a white board and markers or the classic combination of simple lined paper and a pencil.
 

I never used them until 4E came out. I and my group really like using them and have used them for a 1E game as well. I also like wargames. Now if I could just use my Elder Red Dragon to help my armies against Napoleon and my 5-7-4 Panzer chits to take down the demon minions.
 

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