Minor magic feats [PEACH]

[kinem]

What do you think of these?

Minor Cleric Training
prerequisite: Wis 11+, Knowledge (religion) 2 ranks
You can prepare and cast two zero-level cleric spells per day (DC 10 + Wis bonus) with a caster level of 1.
Special: If you later gain a level of cleric, you can swap this for another feat.
If you are a cleric, this feat increases the number of zero-level spells you can prepare.

Minor Druid Training
prerequisite: Wis 11+, Knowledge (nature) 2 ranks
You can prepare and cast two zero-level druid spells per day (DC 10 + Wis bonus) with a caster level of 1.
Special: If you later gain a level of druid, you can swap this for another feat.
If you are a druid, this feat increases the number of zero-level spells you can prepare.

Minor Sorcerer Training
prerequisite: Cha 11+
You know one zero-level sorcerer spell.
You can cast zero-level sorcerer spells twice per day (DC 10 + Cha bonus) with a caster level of 1.
Special: If you later gain a level of sorcerer, you can swap this for another feat.
If you are a sorcerer, this feat increases the number of zero-level spells you know and can cast per day.

Minor Wizard Training
prerequisite: Int 11+, Spellcraft 2 ranks
Choose two zero-level spells from the wizard spell list. You know those spells and record them in a spell book. You can learn additional zero-spells as a wizard would.
You can prepare and cast two zero-level wizard spells per day (DC 10 + Int bonus) with a caster level of 1.
Special: If you later gain a level of wizard, you can swap this for another feat.
If you are a wizard, this feat increases the number of zero-level spells you can prepare.

[Pathfinder variant: You can cast any zero-level spells an unlimited number of times per day. Prereqs are reduced to 1 rank.]

Energize Weapon
prerequisite: ability to cast spells
Choose one type of energy: Cold, Electricity, or Fire. Once this choice is made it can not be changed.
When using a natural or unarmed attack or melee weapon, you can inflict 1 additional point of damage, which is energy damage of the chosen type. Thus, it ignores DR, but is subject to energy resistance.
special: This feat can be taken multiple times, and the effects stack. Cold and Fire damage, however, can not both be applied on the same attack.

Energy Bolt
prerequisite: Energize Weapon
Choose one type of energy for which you have Energize Weapon. You can produce a ray of that type of energy as a standard action at will, which has a 30' range, requires a ranged touch attack, and inflicts 1d6 damage. This is a spell-like ability.
special: This feat can be taken multiple times. If it is taken more than once for the same type of energy, the damage increases by 1d6 each time, and the range increases by 10' each time.

Rapid Minor Magic
When you cast a zero-level spell with a normal casting time of 1 standard action, you can do so as a move action. You can't use this feat on the next round.

Supernatural Minor Spell
Choose one zero-level spell that you can cast. You can use that spell as a supernatural ability, not needing spell components, ignoring SR and not drawing AOO when casting it. Casting it still uses up whatever spell slot and casting time it normally would.

Extraordinary Minor Spell
prerequisite: Supernatural Minor Spell
Choose one zero-level spell for which you have Supernatural Minor Spell. You can use that spell as an extraordinary ability. Casting it still uses up whatever spell slot and casting time it normally would.

 

[Theo R Cwithin]

I rather like these, especially the "Minor XXX Training" ones. I'm not sure about their utility in a higher power game, but I can see a lot of flavor potential arising from these in a lower-power, feat-rich game. Yoinked! Thanks for posting

A few questions:

Energize Weapon: Can the feat be taken multiple times with the same energy type, frex two "Energize Weapon (Fire)" feats would add +2 fire damage. Is that correct? The wording is a little unclear on that point.

Energy Bolt: Does the caster need a weapon in hand to use this feat? (I ask only because Energize Weapon is a prereq.)

Minor Cleric Training: Does this allow the user to prep and cast any two spells from the cleric list? I'm not sure, could that be a little overpowered compared to the other Minor XXX Training feats? Perhaps some sort of limitation is needed? (eg, select two domains when the feat is taken, or something)

 

[Celebrim]

I have almost the identical feats as 'Minor Cleric Training' and 'Minor Wizard Training', except that I call them 'Pious' and 'Dabbler' respectively.

'Pious' requires that you select the three orisons that you know.
'Dabbler' doesn't let you learn additional cantrips.

Both can be taken multiple times.

I don't have/didn't think of the 'swap' special. Not sure if I like it, still thinking about it, but definately can see the point.

As far as the rest, I think Supernatural/Extraordinary minor spell is too weak. And while the ability to ignore SR and anti-magic fields is 'powerful' on one level, the fact that you can only get a 0 level spell effect makes it worthless. I see where you are going with the idea, I'm just not sure it can be made to work. Some things are inherently impossible to balance.

Let me repay you for your ideas. These are feats in my game:

HEDGE MAGICIAN [ARCANE, WIZARD]
You are a working magician and know a lot about the most basic magic.
Prerequisite: ability to cast 0 level arcane spells, 4 ranks of spellcraft, 4 ranks of knowledge (arcane), 4 ranks in alchemy, at least 4 ranks in any one craft skill.
Benefit: You can cast twice the usual number of 0 level arcane spells per day. In addition, you can manufacture any magic item which has 0 level spells and no other spells of higher level as prerequisites, provided that you know those spells, even if you do not have the item creation feat that normally applies. If you do so, you pay half the normal amount of XP in order to manufacture the item.

CANTRIP MASTERY [ARCANE, WIZARD]
You can recall simple spells with just a moment’s thought.
Prerequisite: ability to cast 0 level arcane spells, 4 or more ranks of knowledge (arcane)
Benefit: You gain two additional 0 level spell slots. You do not have to prepare 0 level arcane spells. You can cast without preparation any 0 level arcane spell known to you up to the total number of 0 level spells you can cast per day.

'Wizard' means it can be taken as a wizard bonus feat. 'Arcane' means that you have to be able to cast arcane spells to take the feat.

 

[Theo R Cwithin]

Let me repay you for your ideas. These are feats in my game:
HEDGE MAGICIAN [ARCANE, WIZARD]
CANTRIP MASTERY [ARCANE, WIZARD]

And thanks for posting these, Celebrim! I especially like Hedge Magician-- it neatly handles a couple issues i've been trying to work out imc.

 

[kinem]

Thanks! & thanks for the XP

Energize Weapon: Can the feat be taken multiple times with the same energy type, frex two "Energize Weapon (Fire)" feats would add +2 fire damage. Is that correct?

Yup.

Energy Bolt: Does the caster need a weapon in hand to use this feat? (I ask only because Energize Weapon is a prereq.)

No. Also, you could use Energize Weapon with an unarmed attack.

Minor Cleric Training: Does this allow the user to prep and cast any two spells from the cleric list? I'm not sure, could that be a little overpowered compared to the other Minor XXX Training feats?

Right. I don't think it's overpowered - if you look at the cleric/druid zero-level spell list, there aren't too many powerful options there, even compared to the wizard list.

The sorcerer feat is weaker than the others (you only know one spell) but has no skill prerequisite. Perhaps it should let you cast know 2 spells or cast 3/day.

Are the energy feats too weak? Energy bolt damage could have a bonus of 1/2 your HD. I don't want to step too much on the toes of warlocks or pathfinder domains/schools, though.

Also, as a house rule I'm thinking of giving monks Minor Cleric Training for free. This would let them take Energize Weapon easily.

 

[Celebrim]

And thanks for posting these, Celebrim! I especially like Hedge Magician-- it neatly handles a couple issues i've been trying to work out imc.

I consider it a feat primarily geared toward NPC's, but it does something useful so you aren't sacrificing a whole lot if you take it as a 'flavor' type feat.

For a wizard that will never get beyond 3rd or 4th level in his career, it's very useful. It means he can easily equip himself with a number of utility wands, rings, staffs, and sort that do useful but minor things, and sell similar sorts of useful trinkets and toys to the wealthy. And since at low levels 0 level spells are a significant percentage of his knowledge, doubling those spells is quite significant (especially if you have a large list of 0 level spells, which I do).

We can imagine a typical human 3rd level Wizard NPC of the sort that is the 'Village Wizard' in the same sense as we might have a 'Village Glassblower' or 'Village Blacksmith', who has the Cantrip Mastery, Hedge Wizard, and Dabbler feats. This character has at 3rd level 16 0-level spells per day, usable at will without preparation. To a low level character, he seems a veritable archmage of profound, mysterious and pervasive powers. And, to a high level character, he is just a dabbler - a hedge magician - who plays around with trivial magic to amuse the ignorant. Useful in a way, but certainly no student of the deep lore and mysteries.

 

[Theo R Cwithin]

The sorcerer feat is weaker than the others (you only know one spell) but has no skill prerequisite. Perhaps it should let you cast know 2 spells or cast 3/day.

I think 3/day is the better way to go. That preserves the basic notion that sorcs have more slots but less utility that wizards. Sorcs get more ice cream, but wizards get more flavors.

Are the energy feats too weak? Energy bolt damage could have a bonus of 1/2 your HD.

I think they're fine, especially measured against the others. Personally, I see feats like this as "ace up the sleeve" or "in a pinch" options for a PC, likely a non-caster; I don't think they ought to compete with warlocks, as you pointed out. OTOH, I tend to think about these things in terms of flavor rather than balance, so others may disagree.



I was also thinking about your Su/Ex Minor Spell feats. I agree with Celebrim that they become trivially weak as a character gains levels. But I'd really like to figure out a way to make the idea work, because it's a cool one.

How about expanding the feats to include higher spell levels, limited by the caster's level somehow. For example, here are rewrites of your feats with mods indicated:


Supernatural Minor Spell
Choose one zero-level spell that you can cast, that can be cast by a caster of half your caster level. You can use that spell at half your caster level as a supernatural ability, not needing spell components, ignoring SR and not drawing AOO when casting it. Casting it still uses up whatever spell slot and casting time it normally would.

Extraordinary Minor Spell
prerequisite: Supernatural Minor Spell
Choose one zero-level spell for which you have Supernatural Minor Spell. You can use that spell as an extraordinary ability. Casting it still uses up whatever spell slot and casting time it normally would.

So a 10th level wizard could apply the Su feat to a spell on his list that a 5th level caster can cast, and cast that spell as a Su ability as if he were a 5th level caster. As the wizard rises in level after the feat is taken, the effective CL of the Su (and, later, possibly Ex) ability rises as well, staying at one-half CL.

The decision for the character is between taking the Su feat early and applying it to a lesser spell (with damage cap/limited targets/etc); or waiting til later in the career and applying it to a more powerful spell.

As written, I suspect these mods are overpowered, but I hope you see the angle I'm coming from.

 

[Theo R Cwithin]

I consider it a feat primarily geared toward NPC's, but it does something useful so you aren't sacrificing a whole lot if you take it as a 'flavor' type feat.

That's exactly how I was looking at it. It opens up a lot of possibilities for NPC "jack of all trades" types, witchdoctors, entertainers, and so on-- even charlatans. The minor item creation aspect is especially appealing as it provides a nice way to justify why these minor casters can produce folk remedies, fetishes, charms and the like. I can squeeze a lot of color out of things like this.

 

[kinem]

For a wizard that will never get beyond 3rd or 4th level in his career, it's very useful. It means he can easily equip himself with a number of utility wands, rings, staffs, and sort that do useful but minor things, and sell similar sorts of useful trinkets and toys to the wealthy.

That sounds cool. But what items are we actually talking about? In the SRD there are wands of light and detect magic, but that's about it for items that use 0-level spells.

I imagine that most of the items he sells should be more like potions - one-use or 1/day items that anyone can use.

For example, a bottle of ghost sound. When you unstopper the bottle, a preprogrammed sound issues forth. Assuming you price it like a potion, this would cost 25 gp (sound lasts 1 round) to 75 gp (3 rounds).

I think 3/day is the better way to go. That preserves the basic notion that sorcs have more slots but less utility that wizards. Sorcs get more ice cream, but wizards get more flavors.

Well said.

I think they're fine, especially measured against the others. Personally, I see feats like this as "ace up the sleeve" or "in a pinch" options for a PC, likely a non-caster; I don't think they ought to compete with warlocks, as you pointed out. OTOH, I tend to think about these things in terms of flavor rather than balance, so others may disagree.

Perhaps I should drop the spellcasting prerequisite for Energize Weapon. It should require something though ... I'm still inclined to just go with the higher damage, & would welcome more opinions.

I was also thinking about your Su/Ex Minor Spell feats. I agree with Celebrim that they become trivially weak as a character gains levels. But I'd really like to figure out a way to make the idea work, because it's a cool one.

How about expanding the feats to include higher spell levels, limited by the caster's level somehow. For example, here are rewrites of your feats with mods indicated:

Supernatural Minor Spell
Choose one zero-level spell that you can cast, that can be cast by a caster of half your caster level. You can use that spell at half your caster level as a supernatural ability, not needing spell components, ignoring SR and not drawing AOO when casting it. Casting it still uses up whatever spell slot and casting time it normally would.

Extraordinary Minor Spell
prerequisite: Supernatural Minor Spell
Choose one zero-level spell for which you have Supernatural Minor Spell. You can use that spell as an extraordinary ability. Casting it still uses up whatever spell slot and casting time it normally would.

So a 10th level wizard could apply the Su feat to a spell on his list that a 5th level caster can cast, and cast that spell as a Su ability as if he were a 5th level caster. As the wizard rises in level after the feat is taken, the effective CL of the Su (and, later, possibly Ex) ability rises as well, staying at one-half CL.

The decision for the character is between taking the Su feat early and applying it to a lesser spell (with damage cap/limited targets/etc); or waiting til later in the career and applying it to a more powerful spell.

As written, I suspect these mods are overpowered, but I hope you see the angle I'm coming from.

Interesting ... I'd make it so that you could apply it to a spell of half the max spell level you can cast (min 0) and cast it at half your caster level (min 1). So to apply it to a 3rd level spell, you'd have to be able to cast 6th level spells ... but even a dabbler could apply it to a 0-level spell at 1st level.

 

[Theo R Cwithin]

Interesting ... I'd make it so that you could apply it to a spell of half the max spell level you can cast (min 0) and cast it at half your caster level (min 1). So to apply it to a 3rd level spell, you'd have to be able to cast 6th level spells ... but even a dabbler could apply it to a 0-level spell at 1st level.

That sounds good. I think that makes the math simpler, it's easier to explain, and fixes my bug that prevented low-levels from enjoying the feat. Cool, i'm looking forward to playtesting this someday.


Also,

For a wizard that will never get beyond 3rd or 4th level in his career, it's very useful. It means he can easily equip himself with a number of utility wands, rings, staffs, and sort that do useful but minor things, and sell similar sorts of useful trinkets and toys to the wealthy.

That sounds cool. But what items are we actually talking about? In the SRD there are wands of light and detect magic, but that's about it for items that use 0-level spells.

There are a few Wondrous Items as well (Hand of the Mage comes to mind), but not many. Nevertheless, there's lots of DIY potential in the cantrip power-level range, especially for NPCs. If you haven't seen it, there's a short series of little 10 page pdfs called "Loot 4 Less" by Owen KC Stephens that focuses on very low-cost magic items, and is nice inspiration for items appropriate at this level. (The 3e version may be unavailable now, but it seems to be being re-released for Pathfinder.)