mirror image

[kreynolds]

Oh, so it is a square vs. hex vs. no grid argument?

Hey. I never said it was a good argument!

 

[0-hr]

All variable, numeric effects of an empowered spell are increased by one-half. An empowered spell deals half again as much damage as normal, cures half again as many hit points, affects half again as many targets, etc., as appropriate.

If I have a spell that inflicts (d4 + level) damage and I empower it twice, what does it do?

a) (d4 + level) x 2
or
b) (d4 x 2) + level


If I'm level 10, this makes a pretty big difference

 

[kreynolds]

If I have a spell that inflicts (d4 + level) damage and I empower it twice, what does it do?

a) (d4 + level) x 2
or
b) (d4 x 2) + level


If I'm level 10, this makes a pretty big difference

I always thought it did b).

 

[Dr. Zoom]

The variable is "d4+level," not "d4" +level. So it is a. At level 10, you do from 11 to 14 points of damage. Twice empowered would be double that.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

So you say that when that same caster throws that empowered fireball and rolls really good, say with the initial 10d6 he rolled 50, that the damage he does is only 60, because that is the max-damage of a (normal) fireball?

Where does it explicitly say that fireball stops at 60? Nowhere, and therefore that limit does not exist. But the description of mirror image explicitly says "maximum eight images". And therefore, there are no more than eight images. Since this is not a numerical aspect, it is not increased by 50%.

So a Wiz18 can have 7-8 images, although 1d4+6 could amount to as much as 10 images. If the same wizard would maximize mirror image, it would be 8 images. If a wizard 9 cast empowered mirror image, he would get (1d4)*1,5+3 images, but if he rolled a 4, that would still be 8 (not 9).

 

[Jack Haggerty]

Maybe a stupid question,

Does a damaging area effect like fireball make mirror images dissappear.

I think not, but im not sure.

Outcast

To answer the original question... Yes, fireballs and other area effects will take down the images.

From the SRD, Mirror Image:

Figments seem to react normally to area spells (such as looking like they’re burned or dead after being struck by a fireball).

 

[Kae'Yoss]

So, on a roll of 1 or 4, he gets the same result. On a roll of 2 or 3, he gets one extra image. Does that seem fair to you that half of the rolls result in no extra bonus at all by boosting the spell by two levels? With my interpretation, he gets:

We're not speaking about what's fair, we're speaking about what's the proper rule. I don't care if you rule it that an empowered mirror image can have up to 15 images (or only up to 13 or 10, depending on how you take that maximum of 8 into account, and whether 1d4 or 1d4+lv/3 is subject to the empower effect), but fact is that it will be a house rule. A maximum of eight images is a maximum of eight images is quite enough. You don't have to be able to use every spell with every metamagic feat, after all.
And you see by yourself what problems arise with the empower effect and the maximum. If something is that complicated, you probably misinterpret the rule (except if it's turning undead, of course )

 

[dcollins]

Re: Re: mirror image

To answer the original question... Yes, fireballs and other area effects will take down the images.

No, that's incorrect.

The specification that mirror images "react normally" means normal-for-a-creature (i.e., semi-burnt to the same degree as the caster), not destroyed-and-ceasing-to-exist.

 

[Jack Haggerty]

Re: Re: Re: mirror image

No, that's incorrect.

The specification that mirror images "react normally" means normal-for-a-creature (i.e., semi-burnt to the same degree as the caster), not destroyed-and-ceasing-to-exist.

The spell does not really specify "to the same degree as the caster", either. (Besides, if the images are imitating everything the caster does, this goes without saying, then, doesn't it?) It only says that the images "react normally" to area effect spells. As pointed out in another thread, this is irritatingly vague spell description.

Perhaps the best advise is to ask your DM for his interpretation, since that is the only opinion that really counts.

 

[dcollins]

Re: Re: Re: Re: mirror image

It only says that the images "react normally" to area effect spells. As pointed out in another thread, this is irritatingly vague spell description.

Jack, the specific language that you quoted says mirror images look "burned or dead after being struck by a fireball". There's no way you can reasonably conclude that a mirror image is destroyed by a fireball, when it explicitly says that they look burnt (not disappeared) afterwards.