Mongoose's "State of the Mongoose"

[Pour]

I think 2014 is probably spot on.

As for the nature of 5e, DM prep time, transparency in the rules (and thus the potential for house ruling and customization), and balance are my deciding factors. In the long term, quality support in the way of modules, settings, and DM guides (which the current edition does not have enough of, imho). I'd also like to see a 5e 3pp presence.

Despite it all, 4e has been my favorite edition. I've had absolutely no issues with roleplaying, and I've learned ways to get combats the lengths I want. If we return to monster PC sheets, gross magic-martial imbalances, an overabundance of niche rules, full scale Vancian magic, long prep times, and pointless homages to past rules instead of the concepts and fluff which should rightly be cherished, then I will not be moving on.

I admit, Monte on the team kind of makes me nervous. I don't want OSR or 3e again, and I'm not entirely certain where the design team is heading with this whole modular thing. I want a new edition informed, admittedly, largely by 4e. And as others have mentioned, it needs to have quality material releasing with it at launch- stuff for every tier.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

I see that there is no mention of the Pathfinder material that Mongoose was considering for 2011.... Ah well, I was hoping for a return of the Quintessential series.

As for 5e.... I think 2013 may be on the money, for the announcement at least. Whether it will release in 2013 or 2014...? I dunno.

I also don't know if coming out with 5e will let them recapture their market. Folks are too entrenched in their mechanics at this point. The 3.X/Pathfinder players do not like the mechanics of 4e, and the 4e players wanted changes that were made.

I just don't see the two camps reuniting, arm in arm, as they dance, singing, through the streets. More like two folks that don't like each other at the same party.

If the game is similar to 4e, then I am not interested, and if it is like 3.X... well, I have Pathfinder.

I am sure that the other side of the aisle feels much the same. I don't think that WotC trying to go back to the 3.X architecture will work.

The Auld Grump, which is why we should arm both camps with thermonuclear weapons....

 

[Aberzanzorax]

If I were WotC:

I'd release 5e in 2013.

There is a fantastic opportunity for the anniversary in 2014 to create a lot of buzz separate to a new edition (which itself people will check out on its own merits).


Then, I'd have a slate of anniversary products, ideally across editions. For example:

We've seen from some smaller publishers giganto-products that have done well. (The recent compiled Tome of Horrors, Ptolus, Rappan Athuk, Castle Whiterock, Slumbering Tsar). While these have been to varying degrees, of course, at least the first three sold out fast enough to become collector's editions.

I'm not sure if this is the right packaging, but what would people think of an errataed "all editions of D&D" book? 1e,2e,3,5 with errata, 4e with errata, and even 5e with errata.

Of course there's an obligatory "the past 40 years" product.



But what I'd really like to see, if we have a modular rules driven 5e, is an adventure that can be played "OD&D style" "3.5 style" "4e style" or even "5e style" using the 5e rules. They'd not be the same as those other rules, but close enough that it'd be simple for those familiar with those editions to play.

So, from a marketing perspective, why not release 5e, get the initial buy in, and then release anniversary stuffs that re-pique interest in 5e, but that also honor prior editions?


I doubt that WotC fails to realize the marketing power that the anniversary holds, and I suspect they'll use it more shrewdly than a simple edition release.

 

[Alzrius]

For everyone saying that it feels too early for 5E, consider that we're still a ways away from the predicted announcement, let alone the predicted release.

Presuming that the speculation is right, consider that the announcement won't come for another nine months, until Gen Con 2012. The actual release would be around a year after that. That's a long time.

3.5 got almost five years before 4E came out. A 2013 release would be almost the exact same amount of time for 4E's life-cycle.

 

[drothgery]

It always seems "too early" for an edition change. I will say at this point that WotC would have to knock my socks off to get me look at the D&D game again; I'm quite happy with all the other fantasy (and otherwise) RPGs that are out now. And I'm certainly not interested in another remake/re-envisioning.

I really think 5 years per edition is about the best compromise between when Wizards/TSR runs out of high-volume supplements (that's after about three years; 3e got 3.5'd at that point, and both 3.5 and 4e started running to esoteric products and setting-specific niche products at about that point) and when the player base starts really thinking a new edition is needed (about eight years; 3e was late due to TSR being broke and then the WotC takeover).

 

[Pour]

I really think 5 years per edition is about the best compromise between when Wizards/TSR runs out of high-volume supplements (that's after about three years; 3e got 3.5'd at that point, and both 3.5 and 4e started running to esoteric products and setting-specific niche products at about that point) and when the player base starts really thinking a new edition is needed (about eight years; 3e was late due to TSR being broke and then the WotC takeover).

My only counter to that is 4e doesn't feel stretched thin yet, in my opinion. Maybe it's because of the lack of 3pp, or the way releases and settings have been paced, but to me it seems another 4 years with the edition could yield entirely new and desirable products directly relevant to the core of the game and which do not feel redundant.

 

[drothgery]

My only counter to that is 4e doesn't feel stretched thin yet, in my opinion. Maybe it's because of the lack of 3pp, or the way releases and settings have been paced, but to me it seems another 4 years with the edition could yield entirely new and desirable products directly relevant to the core of the game and which do not feel redundant.

There hasn't been a new race with broad appeal since PH2, they've given up on new settings in favor of cities in the Realms, pretty much everything that would have been a new class in 2008 is a new build in 2011, they've already done the first sourcebook for all the common classes (i.e. the only one that actually sells), they've tried a reboot of the game with Essentials, etc...

I like a lot of what was done in 4e, but it definitely feels like they're scraping the bottom of the barrel for the few books they actually put out these days.

 

[Raith5]

Whether it is 2013 or 2019 I just hope the system is not determined by nostalgia! The thing I like about 4th ed was that it tried new things (surges, at will powers etc) and for the most part they worked really well at the table.

I also hope they have an open beta for the basic guts of the system.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

Whether it is 2013 or 2019 I just hope the system is not determined by nostalgia! The thing I like about 4th ed was that it tried new things (surges, at will powers etc) and for the most part they worked really well at the table.

I also hope they have an open beta for the basic guts of the system.

I can agree with the second part, even if I have my doubts about nostalgia - the innovations made for 4e have made it the number two role playing game.... (An engineer will tell you that most innovations fail. A biologist will tell you that engineers are optimists.... )

But an open playtest can help smooth things quite a bit, rather than springing a nasty surprise on both the gamers and the game designers.

If nothing else, let us hope that any license actually gets seen before it is made boilerplate. (I blame the GSL for the failure of 4e far more than the game system itself. I may not like 4e, but the original terms of the GSL alienated a lot of folks that might have been the game's biggest advocates. And the delays piled upon delays... Oy!)

The Auld Grump

 

[Stormonu]

Y'know, I say that in 2012, WotC should put out collector's editions of each of the major rulesets, as one-book tomes (PHB,MM & DMG in one book), for D&D - 1E, 2E, 3.5E, 4E/essentials, BECM - maybe even OD&D. Leatherbound, no exterior artwork but lavish inside with "artwork of the day" gracing its inside and the best paper grade available today. Other than errata, use the original text of the edition. Let each edition lover have their equally lavish version.

Then in 2013, release 5E based on whichever book sells the best, as clearly, the fans will have spoken which way they want to go.