Monks + Weapon finess + Grapple (+similar)

[Curugul]

My first question is, may a character with the Weapon Finess feat and a light weapon use his dex modifier on the grapple check?

Secondly, does a Monk with an Amulet of Mighty Fists +3 recieve a +3 bonus to his grapple check? If it enhances natural/unarmed attacks, wouldn't this apply to the grapple?


Thanks,

Curugul

ps.
Always grateful for the accurate an swift replies, this boards the best.

 

[Mephistopheles]

You can use weapon finesse and the bonus from the amulet of mighty fists on the initial melee touch attack to initiate the grapple. Grapple checks are specifically laid out as base attack bonus + strength modifier + special size modifier. Additionally, grapple checks are not attack rolls so according to the text of both weapon finesse and the amulet of mighty fists the bonuses do not apply.

If you are grappling with an opponent who is a better grappler than you - in which case you're probably not grappling by choice - you would probably be better off choosing to attack your opponent rather than trying to escape or damage them via grapple checks. This lets you make attack rolls rather than grapple checks so you can benefit from weapon finesse and the amulet of mighty fists. This won't help you maintain a grapple but it might help you escape one indirectly. If you're stuck in a grapple with an opponent who is a better grappler than you perhaps you can do enough damage to encourage them to let you go.

 

[Curugul]

Well

The finess thing I guess I can concede, but isn't it a little strange the Amulet of mighty fists makes your natural attacks/limbs work better, but only if you're mauling/punching with them, not twisting arms or pinning?

Are you 100% sure on that? Or is that simply the way you've always ran it/understood it?

Are there any ways within the rules to gain a bonus to grapple checks, not including size (but via magic)?



Curugul

 

[youspoonybard]

The damage from the AoMF would work, but not the attack bonus granted.

 

[Mephistopheles]

The finess thing I guess I can concede, but isn't it a little strange the Amulet of mighty fists makes your natural attacks/limbs work better, but only if you're mauling/punching with them, not twisting arms or pinning?

Are you 100% sure on that? Or is that simply the way you've always ran it/understood it?

I don't think it's strange. You don't use fists to twist arms or pin someone. You are using your hands and your whole body. As far as the rules are concerned I am quite sure this is correct. An amulet of mighty fists gives you an enhancement bonus to your attack and damage rolls with an unarmed strike or natural weapon. A grapple check is not an attack or damage roll. If you do damage to your opponent while grappling (via the attack your opponent or damage your opponent options) then the damage bonus from the amulet of mighty fists would apply as you are making a damage roll with an unarmed strike.

Are there any ways within the rules to gain a bonus to grapple checks, not including size (but via magic)?

Anything that increases your base attack bonus, your strength or your size will help. Raising base attack bonus is generally not an option, and if you're ruling out size increases then that only leaves strength increases or the improved grapple feat (which you may already have as a monk).