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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ryryguy" data-source="post: 4178672" data-attributes="member: 64945">There seem to be two objections to this approach.  (I haven't read the whole long thread, and I'm paraphrasing.)First, it may be okay for the DM to alter a succubus' charm power to suit a story, but a strong rule is desirable as a baseline for both the DM and the players; making exceptions to the standard power based on (custom) explicit rules is also helpful for the same reason.  This is opposed to "just making it up".Second and relatedly, players need to be able to have at least some sense of the bounds of the succubus' ability to help them to make decisions about how to deal with it; "just making it up" can be frustrating and unfair to them.M.O.'s post suggests ways that 4e may be able to transcend these points...In response to the first point: these kinds of baselines may well be better located in the realm of adventure design rather than creature or power design.  Removing them from specific powers and creatures helps you to use those powers and creatures to tell the kind of story you want to tell, giving the DM so much more flexibility.  This doesn't mean that there are no guidelines, that you are just "making it up" willy-nilly.  The guidelines have been moved to a different domain, one where it seems like they may more properly belong.  Mixing up the rules across the combat and story domains brings the danger that what serves one well may serve the other ill.  Instead of patching them up on an ad-hoc basis, why not just cut the connection?(I'm assuming/hoping here that the 4e books will be providing some guidelines for powers and rituals in adventure design, that it's not just "make it all up!".)In response to the second point: definitely, if the bounds of the succubus' power aren't easily determined, the players are going to get frustrated, so good adventure design requires that they do have avenues to figure stuff out.  The broader skill use that has been described sounds like a great avenue for that; surely there will be more methods.  Also, I think worries that all these "adventure powers" being relatively freeform will confuse players over the long haul are misplaced.  Obviously, a DM should try to keep some of this stuff consistent across the campaign; if the succubus' "adventure domination power" works in a particular way in one adventure, it should tend to work the same way in later adventures, too.  Exceptions in later adventures are possible but also need to be pretty well telegraphed to players and not used as a "gotcha".  And if that means that the succubus "adventure domination" works differently across campaigns, is that a bad thing?  If anything I think it's a good thing, keeping the game fresh, avoiding Monster Manual memorization induced boredom, which I don't think even the "strong baselines" advocates want to see.One last thing about the above quote... but isn't 4e being advertised as easier to DM, or easier for novice DMs?  Perhaps this is not inconsistent.  Perhaps WotC believes that the difficulties for novice DMs lie more in rules confusion, frustration in trying to figure out how to make what they WANT to happen happen in a restrictive framework.  As another poster speculated, perhaps the creative stuff is less difficult for the typical novice DM than the statistical / rules encyclopedia stuff?</blockquote>

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