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[Monsters] Extreme Elimination Challenge!

GlassJaw

Explorer
Since the Trailblazer monster book is going to have a lot more "stuff" and there may be some original monsters submitted by patronage supporters, we are a little concerned about page count, at least for the print version.

So, in the case that we do go over, we may have to cut some monsters.

As a hypothetical, which of the following would you prefer we cut and which would you prefer we keep?

Achaierai
Digester
Lillend
Phantom Fungus
Phasm
Rast
Ravid
Sea Cat
Shocker Lizard
Thoqqua
Tojanida
Xill
Yrthak

Are there any other SRD monsters you wouldn't mind to see get the axe?
 

Alzrius

The EN World kitten
Since the Trailblazer monster book is going to have a lot more "stuff" and there may be some original monsters submitted by patronage supporters, we are a little concerned about page count, at least for the print version.

So, in the case that we do go over, we may have to cut some monsters.
No, you may have to EXTREME cut some monsters.

As a hypothetical, which of the following would you prefer we cut and which would you prefer we keep?
Hm, okay, here's my take on these guys.

Achaierai
Keep it. Yeah it's kinda silly, but this guy has been around since 1E. That kind of pedigree deserves some respect.

I don't hate this creature or anything, but if something's gotta go, give it the axe. It seems to exist solely to make sure that acid attacks are well-represented at the lower levels.

Keep. Sexy outsiders are sexy.

Phantom Fungus
You know, not too long ago I'd have been all for kicking this thing out on its fung-ass. But after reading an ecology article on them from Kobold Ecologies Volume I about how these things are part of a "fungal collective" ruled by none other than the mi-go, I did a complete one-eighty on this invisible 'shroom. Keep it.

How do you waste this much potential? The idea of sentient slime that can take the form of anybody is one you see a lot of throughout the media, and yet the phasm is one of the most forgettable monsters in all of 3.5. Lose it.

No love for this little guy either. Being a spider-legged creature from the Plane of Fire that drinks blood, the rast is a mish-mash of concepts that don't create anything greater than the sum of its parts. Kick it to the curb.

Now this is an idea I can get behind. A creature from the Positive Energy Plane - the Plane of Life itself - that brings everything around to life just through its presence, this is a good idea. Keep it.

Keep it. It's been around forever, and besides, I like cats. ;)

Shocker Lizard
Another thing that seems to exist just to make energy attacks more ubiquitous at lower levels. The "tazer lizard," as I call it, isn't as dumb as some of the other dumb monsters, but it's nothing I'd miss, either. Lose it if you have to.

It's a fire worm, there to make fire attacks more prevalent at lower- oh you know what? Just cut this guy. Seriously, get rid of him.

The only thing the turtlesquidcrab here has going for it is that it comes with three stat blocks for creatures of different ages, making it three monsters for the price of one. Besides that, it has nothing to recommend it except that it's a water-based grappler. Lose it.

When I make a D&D movie, it'll be called "Kill Xill," so you have to leave this guy in. Seriously, the xill has been like an Ethereal-version of the githyanki since 1E, albeit getting far less coverage. Still, the potential is there, and I think this monster can make a great series of adversaries. Keep it.

And rounding out the "we need energy attacks at lower levels" monsters is the yrthak, though it's a bit stronger than the others. I guess if you want to keep sonic damage as something the players should be afraid of - or just to serve as a reminder that that energy type exists at all - this thing does well enough. But otherwise, yeah, it's superfluous. Lose it.

Are there any other SRD monsters you wouldn't mind to see get the axe?
Yeah: I'm looking at you, belker. When's the last time you did anything that was at all noteworthy, huh? Huh!? I didn't think so! Get you and your second-hand smoke outta here!
 

Wulf Ratbane

Villager
Just a quick note:

We have more flexibility with a PDF than we do with the printed version.

There's no reason to cut anything in the PDF and in fact we'll make sure that each monster has plenty of elbow room.

Now, on the other hand, when it comes to the print version, there's a high likelihood we'll have to cut something. There is an absolute upper limit on the number of pages that the spine can hold without the whole book disintegrating. I'll do what I can to mitigate this-- such as moving some of the monsters onto the same page (1 per column rather than 1 per page) and moving some monsters into table format (especially simple stuff that only varies by size, like vermin and animated objects).

But we do need to plan ahead, so your comments are helpful.

FWIW, I am also a fan of keeping the nostalgic monsters (and perhaps even including some more). Many of the "new" monsters in the 3e SRD have nothing to recommend them other than the fact that they are in the SRD.
 

booboo

Villager
Achaierai
Digester
Lillend
Phantom Fungus
Phasm
Rast
Ravid
Sea Cat
Shocker Lizard
Thoqqua
Tojanida
Xill
Yrthak


I would not care if you drop all of them never used any of them anyway
I rather drop some of the looser's and replace them with other third party beast
 

Kid Charlemagne

I am the Very Model of a Modern Moderator
Achaierai - OK either way.
Digester - cut
Lillend - ehn. never used one.
Phantom Fungus - cut
Phasm - cut
Rast - cut
Ravid - cut
Sea Cat - cut
Shocker Lizard - keep, kind of like these
Thoqqua - cut
Tojanida - cut
Xill - Keep; to me they're a D&D classic
Yrthak - cut
 

booboo

Villager
some posable replacments frome the tome of horrors?

Achaierai-ANT LION
Digester-MUCKDWELLER
Lillend-CERBERUS
Phantom Fungus-BELABRA
Phasm-PHANTOM STALKER
Rast-WOLF-SPIDER
Ravid-SHEDU
Sea Cat-HIPPOCAMPUS
Shocker Lizard-FIRE LIZARD
Thoqqua-FIRE SNAKE
Tojanida-EYE OF THE DEEP
Xill-GUARDIAN DAEMON
Yrthak-DRACOLISK
 

ValhallaGH

Villager
Am I the only one that ever used Thoqqua cavalry?
Bunch of "goblins" riding thoqqua, popping out of walls to harrass the invading adventuring party; it was extremely memorable and even my veteran players were wondering what those things were.
 

GlassJaw

Explorer
Am I the only one that ever used Thoqqua cavalry?
Probably!

The only time I can ever remember the word "thoqqua" being uttered at the table was when a player summoned one to burrow/burn through a wall or something.

It's a weird creature.
 

Toy Boy

Villager
Cut them all. But perhaps make a generic "energy attacks at lower levels" monster. Just one stat block that has a different column for the different energy.
 

BryonD

Villager
Cut them all. But perhaps make a generic "energy attacks at lower levels" monster. Just one stat block that has a different column for the different energy.
I don't have an issue either way on keeping or removing the listed creatures.
I would however like to discourage the suggestion here.

Elemental creatures are different in far more than their form of attack.
 

booboo

Villager
I don't have an issue either way on keeping or removing the listed creatures.
I would however like to discourage the suggestion here.

Elemental creatures are different in far more than their form of attack.
it doesn't have to be an elemental creature it could be a magical beast
 

BryonD

Villager
It doesn't matter if they make the generic creature a variety of diminutive giants.

The point is the same regardless of type.
 

BryonD

Villager
I responded to a suggestion that creatures with energy attacks of different types should otherwise be identical with a claim that they should be different in more ways than just the energy of their attack.

To this you say that the point of revision is change.

I must counter that the point of revision is *good* change.
 

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