Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 7206887" data-attributes="member: 996">8d6 fireball at 5th level?  3d4+3 Magic Missile at 1st level?  At-will attack cantrips (how much damage did cantrips do in AD&D? -  maybe 1 pip, mostly none at all, IIRC).  Spell damage scales differently in 5e.   Spells heal significantly more than back in the day, while the healing potion has gone from healing more than a CLW to less than Cure Wounds with a level 1 slot, yes. But it's really not one clear trend.  Relative to 4e, for instance, hps have gone up (because of CON bonus every level), but healing has gone down (6+ 1/4-max-hp surges vs ~ 1-max-hp for total HD), and even that's not a clear trend, because hps at 1st level went way down relative to 4e, while hps at 20 are potentially huge relative to 4e. More specific question.  No, they really didn't in 2e, nor in 3e, spells were just that powerful.   In 4e wizards got more hps, and at-will and encounter spells, but the power of all their spells were greatly curtailed.  In 5e, spells were powered back up, and CON bonus can give the wizard /more/ hps outside of apprentice tier.  We did lose something, we lost the fast-scaling-with-level bonuses (OK, in 1e it was target numbers on matrices, but same net effect) of /every prior edition/ in favor of BA.  Instead, 5e handles scaling with more hps & more damage.  Without that leveling would lose a lot of impact - especially for the fractional- and non- caster sub-classes. Max hps at 1st was a very common variant (I think it came from one of Len Lakofka's articles, along with the d10 initiative variant), in my area some of us even did max + 1d6 (we called them 'peasant points' on the theory that 0-level NPCs had 1d6 hps, and it made no sense for one that became a wizard to potentially lose 2hps - yep, was over-thinking stuff back then, too). Scaling, yes.   It did work, as a sort of hp/damage-'treadmill,' I suppose.  It also became irrelevant as the game degenerated to SoD rocket tag.   Yep, 4e was designed for fewer, longer, more dynamic combats, because 3e had full-attack-based 'static combat' and 'rocket tag' issues.  5e was designed for more faster, simpler combats.  It's a pendulum thang.  ;P Low hps relative to potential maximum damage, if said damage tends to be swingy, sure.  A d12/20x4 weapon in 3e, for instance, gives very swingy damage (especially if you're of the roll-1d12-and-multiply persuasion).  Crits in 5e, not so much, but 5e PCs start out with such low hps even a high damage roll can ruin their day, sure. In the classic game, a rock/paper/scissors/nuke magic-item (if not artifact) contest and/or 'weird wizard show.'  In 3e the afore-mentioned 'rocket tag.'  In 4e, with feat taxes it gets a little easy,ithout the combat dynamic shifts a little to hitting a bit less often with bigger critical hits and use of daily powers mattering more.  5e aims for the classic feel in every other way, so I don't expect it shakes out too much differently - in ultimate 'feel,' that is, the underlying mechanics are obviously different - at high level, though if the 'no items' assumption isn't broken, that aspect's not going to kick in.</blockquote>

Verification