Multiclassing

[Gargoyle]

I have a few concerns with the snippets we've seen about multiclassing in 4ed. I think it could either go very good or very bad. None of the playtest characters that were supposed to be multiclass are described as warllord 5/cleric 3. This leads me to believe that they might force you to pick a primary class, which is the oone you start with, and then give you the option to take talents from another class at some later point.

I find tis disconcerting, as this method severely limits multiclass character concepts. It is cool to have a fighter that has a few spells that can back up his combat. But what happens when my fighter has a mid-life crisis and deides to apply to wizard college?

Personally, I think that the best form of multiclassing would be the one found in ToB. I would really like to see multiclass characters as acually taking levels in both classes, and gaining some sort of slow progression as far as talent trees work.

Does anyone else have any comments on this? Are my fears unfounded?

I wouldn't worry too much.

One advantage of merely taking some talents from another class is that they may have come up with a system that allows you to play a character with abilities from more than one class at level 1.

I've always wanted to have elven fighter/wizards at level 1 that had both fighting and magical abilities at level 1 (like the OD&D "elf" class), but without them being better than 1st level fighters or 1st level wizards. My option in 3e is to have them play a duskblade. Hopefully in 4e I can have them play fighters who have some wizard talents or wizards with some fighter talents. And as they progress I'm hoping their choice of talents and feats allows them to lean in either direction or stay fairly equal in both classes without them becoming too weak or overshadowing characters who do not do this sort of "multiclassing".

Tricky stuff, but I'm betting they come up with something better than 3e.

 

[Sadrik]

The best multi-classing would be at first level so that you can create the concept you want to play with right out of the starting gates.

Eldritch knight and the horror that multi-classing was in 3ed be gone please. Get rid of the: "You gotta take that class first and then the other class whenever you get to 2nd level- Oh, and by the way your character is going to be subpar until you get to 6th level and then you will begin to balance out and eventually you will get more powerful but that is a year or more of game time down the road..."

Please make this horrible experience go away.

 

[Scholar & Brutalman]

I wouldn't worry too much.

One advantage of merely taking some talents from another class is that they may have come up with a system that allows you to play a character with abilities from more than one class at level 1.

I think they could do this fairly easily if characters are like the 3e fighter or the SW Saga system where they get general and bonus feats. Add a feat that's not on anyone's bonus list called Multiclass:

Multiclass: select one other class; you may now choose from its class skills, bonus feat list and power lists as well as from your original class. You may exercise these new choices at the same level as you you bought the feat. You may learn this feat multiple times - each time you do so you must pick a new class.

Example: Mongo, a 1st Level Fighter, chooses to Multiclass to Warlord. As Mongo is 1st level, he may use both the Fighter and Warlord skill lists when picking his trained skills, and both the Warlord and Fighter power list. When Mongo reaches 2nd level, he may pick his bonus feat from those available to both classes.

This wouldn't give you anything extra from the new class by default, just the option of using its choices as well as the original class.

 

[FireLance]

I think they could do this fairly easily if characters are like the 3e fighter or the SW Saga system where they get general and bonus feats. Add a feat that's not on anyone's bonus list called Multiclass

In my view, this is a very nice idea, and could become the 4e re-working of favored classes.

Favored class (fighter): Dwarves gain Multiclass (fighter) as a bonus feat.

 

[Exen Trik]

Nah, a Level 29 Fighter splashing one level of Wizard should get something worthwhile, a Level 16 ability would be too weak.
Abilities should be based on character level only.

That seems to be how it works in 4e, as far as I can tell.

Thus, a fighter taking a level of wizard could get the exact same spell that a straight classed wizard of the same level would be able to, but likely would lack the ability to use it as well. The pure wizard would probably have bonuses to hit and damage, per encounter metamagics, and who knows what other kinds of benefits to his spellcasting from his class levels, paths, feats and equipment.

Of course, powers might also have other requirements besides level, such as other powers, and that could throw a monkey wrench into the whole thing.

 

[Stalker0]

As others have mentioned, playing a multiclass fighter type works just fine. I've played my share of fighter/rogues, ranger/barbs and the like and they are plenty effective. The problem of course is casters.

And really it comes down to a number no one has ever pinned down, what percentage of full casting is the minimum you need to make it useful.

If I have 1/2 the casting power of a wizard, then I might as well forget attack spells. My dcs are too low, my spells do too little damage. At 3/4, I may have too much. I have all of this spell power, coupled with nice hitpoints and AC from other sources.

So what number is the right number?

Enough experience suggests it needs to be more than 1/2. Half a full caster progression doesn't cut the mustard. So 2/3, 3/4?