D&D 5E (2014) My happiness or yours.

[DMZ2112]

My father had a saying - "Don't make perfect the enemy of good."

Ups to your dad; that's awesome.

 

[Vyvyan Basterd]

You know, if those lazy WotC designers would just finish work on their EoD* service, we wouldn't have to endure threads like these anymore.





*Edition on Demand

 

[Dausuul]

As far as I can tell, there were three major categories of people with regard to damage on a miss:

• Hated it.
• Didn't much care.
• Didn't much care, but were annoyed by the furious reaction of those who hated it.

Given that, it's kind of a no-brainer to remove it.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Well seeing as Wizards of the Coast like to quiet some of their fans instead of listening, or possibly fear what some might say, due to some threads being completely erased, I figured I would post it here for discussion.

Man, when you start out with some paranoid conspiracy theory about being silenced, it does not lead me to trust your views in general. This is the Internet, kiddo, if NAMBLA and white supremacists and talk radio blowhards can have websites, then any fool thing with enough goofuses believing in it can get a voice with which to speak.

Now just to be clear, a compromise can't always be reached, nor will one be reached even if it could at times. If there is a way for everyone to get what they want then happy days, but if my happiness has to come at the cost of yours then I can say with all honesty that I can accept that.
...
I feel like if there came a choice, I want to be happy.
...
I was told I'm being selfish for feeling this way, but I feel I am just being realistic

How terrified you must be of other people.

Compromise is not always possible, but this isn't a zero-sum game. We can both be happy. Happiness is an abundant resource, and what's more, you can make it yourself.

Honestly, it's gonna be OK, mate. You're not in any real danger of having your happiness stolen by others. You can not get what you want and still be happy. It might be hard, but if what you want, in the end, is to be happy, it'd probably be worth it, right?

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Mine. Clearly mine.

No, you have it wrong -- clearly, Mine!

Really, I don't see how WotC can be expected to cater to everyone, nor especially any one individual. I think they're giving it a good effort trying to expand the number of optional elements to further help gamers pick and choose, but they still won't satisfy everyone.

But of course the beauty of tabletop RPGs is that it is easy for you to go beyond the rules and continue to tailor the game to your liking. Dislike a game element? So what -- change it! If too many changes are required, perhaps that game isn't for you. And by this time, there are certainly a lot of options even under the D&D label to choose from.

Frankly, I'm exasperated by the wailing and gnashing of teeth over little game elements. We should be thrilled to have so many games and game options to choose from.

 

[oxybe]

in a vacuum? my happiness over yours 100% of the time, unless for some reason your being less happy then me can have some serious repercussions on my personal life, but given a single option in a vacuum and no other surrounding variables, i'll pick me over someone else.

also, by the unlogic (or Xunlogic, as it may be) the op uses, i guess paizo should be getting ready to close up shop on their 3.5 clone and bring out a 4th ed clone, since well, i didn't find pathfinder to be the cat's pajamas so i'm darn entitled to have them drop their game and fanbase and make one just for this little special snowflake right 'ere. right?

look, i can see getting angry about gamestuffs. you invest not just financially into it, but emotionally in the world, characters and stories you and your pals create. a major rule change does seem like it can threaten those things you hold dear since if you do buy into the change, characters and/or worlds might not work or exist as you know them. i was like that too a few years back.

i then decided to apply something i learned on the playground days to my TTRPG lifestyle: you know what make me happier then being angry about games i don't play? playing games that make me happy instead.

really my options in life can generally boil down to choosing between "will i be happy or not-happy with this thing?". so why choose the latter when the former is much more appealing?

and there is always the old adage of not fretting over things you can't control.

this is one of the reasons i left my 7-year group who kept on playing pathfinder, a system which i grew more and more irritated with, and told them to grab a player that would be more enthusiastic about the system since i know i can't get them to change systems. plus, i wouldn't want to impose that much selfishness on the group... i like these guys, they're a pretty cool bunch of nerds.

and it's not like i don't get to see them: i'll drop down on wednesdays and say hi on the rare occasion before their session begins then leave when it starts. all in all, i would say i'm a happier guy for it, i don't drag them down with my lack of energy AND i still get to see them.

plus, i get to use my wednesdays to play games i do like.

5th ed, in it's current form, doesn't seem to indicate it's going to be a game i care for. i can appreciate the ideology behind some of the stuff they're putting out, but more then a few concepts or the current application of the ideology i simply don't care for. so instead of complaining 'bout games i don't play (or plan on playing) and going in an eventual downward spiral of bad feels, i simply go "nope, not for me" and keep doing stuff i like.

i really don't care if WotC releases a version of D&D i don't care for. either they release something i like and i play it, or they release something i don't and i instead play something i like. my brand loyalty to D&D died quite a while ago, somewhere towards the end of 3rd ed's lifecycle before 4th came out.

when 4th was released, i only bought the supplements that had stuff i wanted in it or expected to use rather then anything with "DUNGEONS AND DRAGONS" splayed on the cover. again, this smart purchasing habits meant i had more money to spend on stuff that would make me happy as opposed to a book i probably would not use (like say, divine power, because i simply don't care for for those classes)

in the end, i've simply decided to leave myself open to be pleasantly surprised with 5th, but fully expect something i don't care for. this way i either get something new that makes me happy or i keep playing something that currently makes me happy and i have money to spend on other stuff that potentially makes me happy.

all in all, i guess i win regardless of your circumstances.

 

[amerigoV]

I think I answered this in another thread already.

Definitely my happiness over yours. And I likely will get even more joy knowing that you're unhappy. Such is the way of the Internets.

I am hoping that you will cry now, I need a pick-me up. Its been a long day at work.

 

[Ichneumon]

I think I answered this in another thread already.

Definitely my happiness over yours. And I likely will get even more joy knowing that your unhappy. Such is the way of the Internets.

I am hoping that you will cry now, I need a pick-me up. Its been a long day at work.

Yeah, regardless of happiness, I want the release of 5e to give me the biggest schadenfreude hit.

 

[Remathilis]

"My happiness or yours."

Mine. duh.

 

[SteveC]

As far as I can tell, there were three major categories of people with regard to damage on a miss:

• Hated it.
• Didn't much care.
• Didn't much care, but were annoyed by the furious reaction of those who hated it.

Given that, it's kind of a no-brainer to remove it.

Well, I can tell you that I'm living proof of the "I liked it option." Did every character I generate have it? Nope, but I thought it was interesting design and mirrored the already existing "save for half mechanic." In 4E it was also much less useful due to the increased HP that monsters had, and the fact that you couldn't do damage to minions on a miss.

So, nope, not a no-brainer to remove it. Doing something that restricts characters options is pretty much a universal "no-no" in my book, so long as the option is mechanically sound. And damage on a miss is entirely mechanically sound, it is just the flavor of how it works that irks people. Once you're saying "how can you not miss? That's totally not realistic..." you're moving into fluff territory, and I will say that's entirely a matter of choice and opinion.

I won't argue whether or not damage on a miss is something that anyone in particular should take, but does it belong in the game? Sure, along with many other options ... a lot of which I wouldn't choose personally.