My issues with the Force Awakens (Spoilers)

[Tonguez]

Yep, that'd be my one true complaint with TFA. That it was essentially a remake of ANH. A really good, entertaining, remake, but a remake none-the-less....

Here's hoping Episode 8 is more original.
(I also hope that Luke will get killed off in the 1st 15 minutes)

So the hero tracks down the ancient master who has been living in seclusion on a isolated planet, he inspires the hero and then dies but occasionally is heard as a force ghost- thats original "do or do not, there is no try"

 

[QuaziquestGM]

For me, it felt like a Star Wars movie and looked like a Star Wars movie. I liked the attention to detail in the First Order base. The wall panels and background details looked like what an Imperial base should look like.

I agree with the criticism that the Resistance should have sent more than 3 people in the ground strike team, but we got to see them literally throw the plan together in 4 minutes. Maybe the commando squad wasn't in town....

My problems are related to Starkiller base, the new X-wing design, and one photography/3d conversion error.

In reverse order.

1) Photography problem. I'm glad the film didn't make the same stupid choice that seems to be in every other modern sci-fi and fantasy film: back ground blur on what should be a smooth "fly-by shot". If there is an interesting background, why don't they let us see it? I'm glad they didn't do that.

Which makes it infuriating that they screwed up a "interior reveal" crowd shot at the "cantina". "Don't stare." "At what?" Any of it."....

And we couldn't stare because as soon as they walked though the door everything became distorted for 5 seconds....
Was this a problem with the 2d print of the 3d movie? Or just the copies sent to Indonesia? I've seen it in 2 different theaters and both had this problem. The scene before they walked in, and the "look at the aliens" shots where fine, but the walk-in was an unwatchable mess. Did anyone else notice this?

2) The T 70 . This was something I noticed during the film, but thought, "No, I'm looking at it wrong. It will make sense when I see the model/toy" and then went back to enjoying the film. But then I looked at the model and I'm back to "That can't be right. The modeler most have forgotten/not known about basic turbine/turbofan design and just made something that looks cool".

have a look:

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2015/09/x-wing-episode-vii-miniatures-x-wing-tie.html

How can you cut a turbine/turbofan in half across the axis of rotation? If it just looked like an air intake I'd accept it without question, but it looks like a jet turbine engine.

3) StarKiller base. My main problem is the timeline for construction. They didn't have the full 30 years to make it. That can be handwaved by saying that it was a repurposed terraforming project, or an repurposed alien/ancient artifact, or something the old Empire started that the First Order just finished. But it didn't look like they had enough people to build it, or enough time.

My second is that they fired it once, and were going to fire it again, and didn't "eat" a star the first time. Maybe it has a slow charge and a quick charge mode, and the slow charge works like a passive solar cell. As for the active mode, my thinking during the film is that it didn't eat the star, but took enough energy for the surface to cool and dim. There isn't enough room in a planet to hold the plasma of a star.... unless they have a way to hold it in a hyperspace area...But then they didn't eat a star for the first shot....

As for the planetary arrangement of the Hosnian system, I think that the cantina planet was on in the habitable zone not far form the targeted planet, and the other visible target "planets" were either moons or smaller planets in the L-zones.

 

[Morrus]

I agree with the criticism that the Resistance should have sent more than 3 people in the ground strike team, but we got to see them literally throw the plan together in 4 minutes. Maybe the commando squad wasn't in town....

I think that was my biggest issue. The base never "felt" menacing the way the Death Star did. They discovered it and then put together a plan to destroy it in, like you say, 4 minutes. It felt very casual.

 

[QuaziquestGM]

I think that was my biggest issue. The base never "felt" menacing the way the Death Star did. They discovered it and then put together a plan to destroy it in, like you say, 4 minutes. It felt very casual.

But "menace" can be like an "inverse ninja" thing. There is a tipping point where "More" isn't "better". The 1-3 Velocaraptors chasing the "hero kids" in Jurassic Park seem more menacing than the unseen pack of them grabbing mercenaries in the grassland in JP2, and the 1 T rex from Jurassic Park seems "objects in mirror" big and a real Lawyer and Mathematician eating threat , but the "just ate Jaws as a SeaWorld trick" moasaur in Jurassic World is so big that it is merely a "eat the personal assistant as a South Park vs Chef" joke until it becomes a Checkoffs Dinosaur. It is so big that it doesn't threaten the human heroes, it threatens the T rex size dinosaurs. 9/11 seemed real and threatening when you spend the day watching it live on the news, yet a months long ISIS led war killing many more people over many months seems somehow less threatening at times....Jr. Varsity even... Godzilla movies have the same issue: Too Small (USA) and it's not scary enough, but too big and he seems cartoonish cause you can't even make out the cars he is stepping on. It is hard to get the Goldilocks size for a threat, because it can get too big to process.

But I don't have an issue with how the Resistance handled it. Anyone who would be running in circles and panicking over the destruction of the Republic capital wouldn't be at the Resistance base anyway. These are hardened warriors, the third generation to be doing this, with leadership who have been doing this sort of thing for more than 35 years...

They are going to put aside their fear, anger, grief and do something about this Right Damn NOW before any other planet gets blown up, but they aren't going to go off half cocked either. They are going to gather intel on the location of the Enemy weapon---Here it is! They drew a line in the heavens between Hosia and where they fired from. -- Gather intel on that position---with the scout ship they (probably) immediately launched to get long range scans while the x-wings were on their way to engage the first order forces at "cantina". They will gather what signal and human intel they can --"No, New jacket. BTW, I've got a First Order defector with me...." And probably 2-3 hours later they will gather to compare notes, and realizing they don't have long before this thing is reloaded, that THEY are the next target, spend 4 minutes planning (cause are they really going to come up with a better plan in an hour? ""Throw everything we got at it before it kills us" is about as good as it gets in this timeframe. ) and then send the only fighters they have on-hand to go take care of this problem. Better in the air than on the targeted base anyway. This Death Star is already in range and cleared to fire. Launch fighters and hope Han gets that shield down in time...

If it seemed to casual, it is because they are professionals who are used to long odds. Any rebel/resistor who momentarily gets awed "Look at the size of that thing!" will be deftly brought back into focus by experienced leadership. "Cut the chatter, Red Two.".

"So its big. How do we blow it up? " says the Legendary General Han Solo who their leader Princess/Senator/General Organa followed into the ground assault on Endor... thank the gods he showed up today with a First Order defector who worked on the weapon.... If the old guys (Leia, Han Ackbar) are handling this calmly, that will keep the newer hands focused and on task...

And Han was treating it as a suicide mission anyway, he just never mentioned it to anyone but Chewie (and he probably didn't even need to tell him). Plan A) get the shields down and die when the X wing strike blows up the planet. Plan B) Explosives to blow it up our selves somehow if the x wing strike doesn't work. Plan C) Ram it with the Falcon, if it survived the landing. "We aren't leaving with out her" was because he wasn't planning to leave at all. Sure, he would have tried to get away if it were an option, but he really had no way of knowing it would be a "Force 10 from Naverone" 'slow-motion' explosion after blasting the (Dam) oscillator. Even if he had turned Ben and gotten back to the Falcon, if the x-wings weren't getting the job done, he would have flipped around and rammed it at near light speed.

 

[Ryujin]

2) The T 70 . This was something I noticed during the film, but thought, "No, I'm looking at it wrong. It will make sense when I see the model/toy" and then went back to enjoying the film. But then I looked at the model and I'm back to "That can't be right. The modeler most have forgotten/not known about basic turbine/turbofan design and just made something that looks cool".

have a look:

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2015/09/x-wing-episode-vii-miniatures-x-wing-tie.html

How can you cut a turbine/turbofan in half across the axis of rotation? If it just looked like an air intake I'd accept it without question, but it looks like a jet turbine engine.

You're obviously right about that; it can't. That bothered me too, but is likely an artifact of "kit bashing" and a lack of understanding/care as to the functions of parts. Kit bashing is a practice in which modellers take bits from various plastic model kits, in order to create interesting structures on their practical effects models. If I remember correctly many of the models made for Star Wars used parts from tank model kits, among others.

They just go with what looks cool/appropriate. Somtimes more from column "A" than column "B".

 

[amerigoV]

On Solo's Death - While I presume that its permanent, they did do the classic body fade into blackness. Since this is pulp, no one is dead unless you have their rock cold body in a slab next to you. For that matter, even Palpatine could be around given the way he went out.

It would not surprise me Solo he shows up on Eps 8 in some flashback scenes that might give more background to the rift in the family (him arguing with Ben, for example).

While I really enjoyed the movie, I do wish that if there were going to remake some of the movies they would have redone the Prequels - that was the crap that desperately needed redone, not Eps IV.

Rey's Parents
The movie certainly pushed us to think Luke is Rey's father. Some think its still another Solo kid somehow (basically put into hiding to either keep from Ben/Kylo Ren, or even Kylo Ren hid her from Snoke in a last act of goodness - but this may just be echos of the old EU with the Solo twins).

I saw this fun theory today - Rey is Kenobi's granddaughter. Its a pretty good theory:
https://medium.com/@benostrower/rey-is-a-kenobi-362b5af09849#.6022861td

So I have an even more fun theory - Rey is both Luke's daughter and Kenobi's granddaughter! How? Well, there is this fun theory bouncing around before Eps 7 released in a vain effort to make the prequels tolerable:

https://www.yahoo.com/tv/one-simple-trick-makes-star-221500306.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb

So perhaps Luke and Leia are Obi's, and not Anakins. So the big reveal in Eps 8 or 9 is Ben/Kylo Ren is NOT related to Anakin/Vader. He is really named after his grandfather Obi Wan. I can see the scene now - the Ghost of Obi comes before Rey and Kylo Ren "While Anakin was being seduced by the Dark Side, I seduced Padme's dark side."

It explains why Vader did not sense Leia was his daughter despite looking like Padme and him torturing her - it was not his daughter. The only reason he even knew about Luke was the last name - an bit of final f-u from Obi Wan ("son of Skywalker" = Padme name, if taken in marriage). That is why he struggled with what to do with Luke - kill him, or turn him (a final revenge to Obi Wan). And it helps make the slaughter of the younglings in Eps 3 more understandable - they represented the abomination(s) in his wife's womb. Finally, how prophetic Obi Wan's line about Darth Vader killing Luke's father turns out to be. Its true, from a certain point of view.

Star Wars Game of Thrones

 

[ccs]

So the hero tracks down the ancient master who has been living in seclusion on a isolated planet, he inspires the hero and then dies but occasionally is heard as a force ghost- thats original "do or do not, there is no try"

Yes, admittedly that sounds like RotJ.

But I'm limited in what I can wish for since Abrams included the character in the new films. MY ideal would be that none of the original characters would be involved. But they are. So the quicker they're killed off & prevented from eating up screen time (wich should be spent on the new characters) the better.
I doubt it'll happen.

 

[Eltab]

Even if he had turned Ben and gotten back to the Falcon, if the x-wings weren't getting the job done, he would have flipped around and rammed it at near light speed.

Near the end of Ep6, Lando is flying the Falcon out of the exploding Death Star. He must be moving at almost lightspeed - he's trying to outrun a nuclear blast. Somehow he gets out of the tube at .99 C - aimed straight at the nearby planet(and the Rebel Fleet) by the way - and just coasts down to a smooth trot in nothing (as in 'zero distance') flat. He needed more room than that to come out of hyperspace.

I thought, for dramatic effect:
-existing film: Lando looking at flaming superstructure "This is gonna be close...",
-insert a new shot where the Falcon is shown - on Ackbar's battlezone holomap? - as a blue dash zipping away from the Death Star at a random angle in 3-space (This shot should be so fast that viewers think "Did I just see / miss something?")
-existing film: explosion scene
-existing film: Lando's reaction

 

[Tonguez]

Yes, admittedly that sounds like RotJ.

But I'm limited in what I can wish for since Abrams included the character in the new films. MY ideal would be that none of the original characters would be involved. But they are. So the quicker they're killed off & prevented from eating up screen time (wich should be spent on the new characters) the better.
I doubt it'll happen.

Thats a big question now I suppose, theres really no cliffhanger to set up the next movie so what exactly are they going to do with the story to make it different.

As indicated above I liked the 'hand over' aspect of this movie and I don't think the old crew overshadowed the new or hogged too much time. Besides the two biggest threats here were Han (who has been dealt with) and Luke (the new Yoda?). Of course 7 did leave lots of threads dangling but the story told in it was a complete one - the Weapon was destroyed and the bad guys beaten (or at least severely weakened).
Now we have Rey 'encountering' Luke, Finn recovering and Kyro Ren licking his wounds and trying to get back on side with his master. I'm not seeing too much epic in that. Are they going to have Leia seek revenge? Is it going to be a political movie rebuilding the republic and hunting the last of the First Order? Is it going to be lots more stealth and hidden plots or Rey, Chewie and Luke doing a grand Quest?

Also is Snoke Darth Palagueis

"Darth Plagueis was a Dark Lord of the Sith so powerful and so wise, he could use the Force to influence the midi-chlorians to create life. He had such a knowledge of the dark side, he could even keep the ones he cared about from dying."

did he use his powers to resurrect the original movie?

is Rey really the resurrected corpse of Padme or the clone of Anakin?

 

[hopeless]

Would the movie have been better if they kept Poe involved?

He gets to fly the Falcon maybe recognizing the ship and because he's met Leia actually flies the Falcon to meet Han & Cheque hoping to get their help?

Rey reveals her mechanics prowess but removes that part of the claimed Mary Sue and we know how Poe left Jakku.

Han taking them to Maz is a deliberate attempt to not lead the First Order to the Resistance base as he has yet to discover if he can trust Finn.

Starkiller Base is actually a small Dyson Sphere like construct that recharges itself inside a system the charging is used to render any worlds in the system uninhabitable if they intersect the charged stream of energy travelling from the star to Starkiller Base. It uses the accumulated energy to travel to other star systems and went to the New Republic's current capital as they tried to use their puppet senators to bring Leia there do they could eliminate the only opposition to their forces.

Leia naturally sent an envoy but didn't expect them to pull a Death Star attack!

How does that sound to you?

Anyway is it possible Snoke is a disfigured Grand Inquisitor who survived his fall at the end of season 1 of Star Wars Rebels?

Could Rey be Ezra's daughter?

With the First Order kidnapping kids as new recruits maybe she was left with someone Ezra trusted but they died in the following years but not before Rey learned to survive by herself?

Is it possible Rey received enough training to be about padawan level and Kylo isn't even trained to that level and the reason that she best him even though he was actually more powerful as a Skywalker its just that his injuries left him unable to fight Rey properly?

Yes well just a thought!