My poor LBEG - what went wrong?

[devilish]

Very disappointing weekend : I'd like to know what I could've done differently.

Characters enter a room with a necromancer and his 5 zombies -- DMG and
U_K's system call this a "Very Difficult" encounter. Necromancer is at
his desk, back against the wall (this is important later). They "palaver" -- "Fools, you'll
be destroyed..." etc.etc.

Combat Begins - no surprise round.

Fighter rolls first initiative, walks *through* the room, threading around the
zombies and comes right up to the necromancer. ( All creatures are flat footed
before their initiative hits in the round, and flat footed creatures cannot use
AoO -- so they helplessly watch him cross the room to the necromancer.)
Fighter hits necromancer, great damage.

Zombies amble across the room on their turn, one gets to attack the fighter.
Necromancer tries to cast a spell defensively. Because his back's to the wall,
his 5-foot shuffle prior to casting still keeps him in AoO range of the fighter.
He *fails* 1st concentration, gets hit, *fails* second concentration - spell
fizzles.

On their rounds, cleric destroys all the zombies, ranger fires a crossbow bolt in the
necros chest -- encounter over.

Was I just the victim of bad rolls (necros poor initiative, failed concentration checks)?
What could I have done differently (besides the necro not being against the
wall)? How would you have handled it? Even with bad rolls, how could the
characters have cleaned up so quickly and how could it be a "very difficult" encounter?


Many thanks,
-D

 

[Lord Pendragon]

I think you'll need to provide more details. The levels of the PCs and necromancer, HD of the zombies, etc.

 

[Seeten]

Yeah, sounds like a lot of our combats. Good choices, and tactics negate dangerous foe.

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Uh ... How did the fighter get an AoO on the Necromancer?

When you cast defensively, you automatically do not provoke an AoO. The roll merely determines whether or not you get your spell off successfully.

 

[devilish]

Details : Regular zombies (CR 1/2) : gnome necromancer 5th level.
Party members: : Fighter(4), Thief(4), Cleric(4), [NPC] Sorceress(2), [NPC]
Ranger(3).
[EDIT] Forgot the Psion(3).

Uh ... How did the fighter get an AoO on the Necromancer?

When you cast defensively, you automatically do not provoke an AoO. The roll merely determines whether or not you get your spell off successfully.

Ahh...that might be it, right there. The SRD, as far as I can find, does not
explicitly state that you can't AoO.

Concentration
If the Concentration check succeeds, you may attempt the action normally without provoking any attacks of opportunity...[taking 10]...If the Concentration check fails, the related action also automatically fails (with any appropriate ramifications), and the action is wasted, just as if your concentration had been disrupted by a distraction.

It says, if it succeeds, there's no AoO -- but it doesn't say if it fails, the action is wasted
and the opponent does/doesn't get an AoO. I can't find where it states "casting
defensively will always negate an AoO".

I failed my concentration check at the time and had someone look this up for
me. Is it explicitly stated somewhere else (or can someone see how I'm
reading this incorrectly?)

 

[kenobi65]

It says, if it succeeds, there's no AoO -- but it doesn't say if it fails, the action is wasted
and the opponent does/doesn't get an AoO. I can't find where it states "casting
defensively will always negate an AoO".

I failed my concentration check at the time and had someone look this up for
me. Is it explicitly stated somewhere else (or can someone see how I'm
reading this incorrectly?)

Yup. In the section on "Casting on the Defensive", from the Combat chapter:

Casting on the Defensive: Casting a spell while on the defensive does not provoke an attack of opportunity. It does, however, require a Concentration check (DC 15 + spell level) to pull off. Failure means that you lose the spell.

It's not a successful Concentration check that negates the AoO chance; it's the choice to cast on the defensive. So, indeed, there should not have been an AoO there.

 

[devilish]

Yup. In the section on "Casting on the Defensive", from the Combat chapter:

It's not a successful Concentration check that negates the AoO chance; it's the choice to cast on the defensive. So, indeed, there should not have been an AoO there.

Most excellent! I completely read that incorrectly. Thanks kenobi65 and Patryn of Elvenshae for pointing that out ( and giving the BBEG a leg up in the next session.)

Anything else anyone would recommend? Or does it look like (minus this botch)
as Seeten points out, good dice rolls and tactics v. bad?

I'm still having trouble with the "Very Difficult" attribute -- even if the necro didn't
get clobbered in the first round, the cleric fried the whole zombie troop.

 

[mikebr99]

And shouldn't his desk be in the way of either the fighter &/or the crossbowman?

Mike

 

[jerichothebard]

Most excellent! I completely read that incorrectly. Thanks kenobi65 and Patryn of Elvenshae for pointing that out ( and giving the BBEG a leg up in the next session.)

Anything else anyone would recommend? Or does it look like (minus this botch)
as Seeten points out, good dice rolls and tactics v. bad?

I'm still having trouble with the "Very Difficult" attribute -- even if the necro didn't
get clobbered in the first round, the cleric fried the whole zombie troop.

Zombies are CR 1/2 creatures - yeah, a decently built cleric's going to nuke them, every time. You will need a lot more than five to really threaten them. Or just move up to ghouls. Zombies are really only appropriate for about levels 1 and 2. I realized that, just like you did, the hard way. When my characters jumped on a boat with a half dozen zombies and a half dozen skeletons and just mowed them down in a round or two -without breaking a sweat or taking a hit. This was right around level 4, too.


jtb

 

[Lord Pendragon]

Details : Regular zombies (CR 1/2) : gnome necromancer 5th level.
Party members: : Fighter(4), Thief(4), Cleric(4), [NPC] Sorceress(2), [NPC]
Ranger(3).

So the party is an average level of 4, and the CR of the encounter is, what?, 5? I'm not familiar with U_K's system for determining the encounter "Very Difficult"...but eyeballing it it seems fairly easy.

You have one CR 5 critter that also happens to be a spellcaster. At low levels, spellcasters are easy pickings unless you've got some meat in front of them. Your meat, the zombies, are CR 1/2 vs. a 4th-level cleric. That's as good as no meat at all.

I don't think this encounter would have gone much better, even if you'd denied the AoO due to Casting Defensively. The deck is stacked against the necromancer in the first place.

Some suggestions to buff up such an encounter:

* Use more zombies. A lot more. That way even if the cleric turns/destroys half of them, you've got some meat between your spellcaster and the party.

* Give the necromancer more room or a more tactically advantageous position. Put an iron grating around his desk. Make the room 60' x 60' (with some pit traps in there.) At low levels, a spellcaster in melee range is a dead spellcaster.

* Give the necromancer a few potions. I tend to like Invisibility. Then he can spend a round or two buffing up before he engages the party. Summoning some help. etc.