Natural 20's & 1's?

[Jhaelen]

We're talking about 4E right (this is the 4E forum)? Who cares about other editions?

You may want to review what you've posted then:

Personally, I feel that crits in 4E are kind of whack and flavorless. Max damage? I can get that without rolling a 20...

(emphasis mine)

Item 1: Why did you write 'in 4e'? Did you maybe forget for a second that this is the 4e forum? If you didn't, it suggests you wanted to stress that you disliked crits in 4e particularly.

Item 2: The bolded statement is only correct in a minority of cases. As abyssaldeath and myself have pointed out.

Are you saying because older editions only did "more damage" that's what it should be in 4E (and future editions)?

No I'm not.

See above. My whole point was to point out the above two items to you.

 

[P1NBACK]

You may want to review what you've posted then:
(emphasis mine)

Item 1: Why did you write 'in 4e'? Did you maybe forget for a second that this is the 4e forum? If you didn't, it suggests you wanted to stress that you disliked crits in 4e particularly.

Jhaelen, I think you're reading into it and adding your own stresses. Sounds like you were taking offense at me making a minor criticism of 4E. Calm down. This thread is about what DMs do on a 1 and 20. Arguing that what a particular DM does or thinks is totally derailing the thread.

Item 2: The bolded statement is only correct in a minority of cases. As abyssaldeath and myself have pointed out.

Maybe a minority of cases in your games. Not in mine.

 

[renau1g]

[MENTION=83768]P1NBACK[/MENTION] - have crits ever been anything but extra damage/auto-miss in D&D?

 

[P1NBACK]

@P1NBACK - have crits ever been anything but extra damage/auto-miss in D&D?

Only in houserules.

Like I said, I'm talking about a missed opportunity with a new edition of D&D. I don't care how 4E design relates to the old versions outside of the basic scope of the game. Were Fighter encounter powers ever in D&D? Healing surges? So, how is this an argument (a way off-topic argument)?

 

[Ryujin]

Just 5% of turns.

But, really. This thread isn't for those people is it? It's for the people who do something on a 1 or 20.

Actually I believe that the question was, "What do you do...", to which "Nothing." is a valid response.

 

[P1NBACK]

Actually I believe that the question was, "What do you do...", to which "Nothing." is a valid response.

I agree. I'm not talking about the people who said "nothing" - I'm talking about the people arguing with the people who responded to this post in what their point of view is on the topic. Instead of having a flourishing discussion about different ideas for rolling 1s and 20s, we have a discussion about whether my opinion that 4E missed a design opportunity is "valid" or not. Wtf is that about? The only way that makes sense is if you have a bunch of people furiously defending the core design of 4E instead of actively talking about their ideas for what to do on a 1 or 20.

If you want to discuss (argue against) MY opinion on the matter, make a new thread and I'll happily devote some time to why I think the way I think and why "but they didn't do it in 3.5 or 2e or 1e!" is the most retarded argument I could ever think up. Otherwise, we're just monopolizing this thread about what DMs do on 1s and 20s with your arguments against one poster's opinion.

 

[Jhaelen]

If you want to discuss (argue against) MY opinion on the matter, make a new thread and I'll happily devote some time to why I think the way I think and why "but they didn't do it in 3.5 or 2e or 1e!" is the most retarded argument I could ever think up. Otherwise, we're just monopolizing this thread about what DMs do on 1s and 20s with your arguments against one poster's opinion.

See, the bolded part, imho, is the reason this thread got derailed in the first place. It's the way you're expressing your opinion that rubs me the wrong way, causing me to be unable to concentrate on the real topic of this thread.

You accuse me of being overly defensive of 4e. Fine. But you are defensive about everyone who doesn't agree with you, even if your arguments have been proven wrong.

So, let's get back on topic:
I don't feel natural ones and 20s should do something beyond what they're already doing. I'm not overly fond on the Dark Sun rule for weapon breakage, either.

Natural ones are an auto-miss, and 20s do (at least) max damage. What more do you need?

Crit tables are something that is best done as house-rules, as they've always been done. Maybe we'll see something in that direction in the Unearthed Arcana series.

And then (as I've already mentioned in this thread) there will be the Fortune Cards, and the setting specific cards, like the Doom cards in the Shadowfell box to inject some random element into combats which fills a similar design space. I expect these to appeal to the same kind of players who enjoy using crit/fumble tables.

 

[P1NBACK]

See, the bolded part, imho, is the reason this thread got derailed in the first place. It's the way you're expressing your opinion that rubs me the wrong way, causing me to be unable to concentrate on the real topic of this thread.

lol...

You accuse me of being overly defensive of 4e. Fine. But you are defensive about everyone who doesn't agree with you, even if your arguments have been proven wrong.

I'm not defense about people not agreeing with me. I could care less. I'm defensive about people using the thread to on other people's opinions.

How can my arguments, which are opinions, be proven wrong? lol... You can't prove opinions wrong.

But, I digress. Really, Jhaelen. If you feel one of my posts offends you, PM me about it. That's all I've got to say on the topic. Sorry to be accomplice to this thread's derailment.

 

[renau1g]

Only in houserules.

Like I said, I'm talking about a missed opportunity with a new edition of D&D. I don't care how 4E design relates to the old versions outside of the basic scope of the game. Were Fighter encounter powers ever in D&D? Healing surges? So, how is this an argument (a way off-topic argument)?

I wasn't arguing, just asking a question. Calm down home fry. You take everything way too personally.

I tried the random tables before and at first the players loved it. We had one where you took a -1 to attack rolls next round as you had to recover, all the way up to sever your own arm, on a 1, then a 100%... but after a couple super-fails the party really didn't like it. Oh, and when the enemy crit and took off the fighters sword hand...they really didn't like it. Plus it bogged down the game.

 

[P1NBACK]

I wasn't arguing, just asking a question. Calm down home fry. You take everything way too personally.

I'm calm, bud. Thanks for being concerned though. Much appreciated.