Need suggestions for a few ideas my players had.

[LordVyreth]

A few of my players are really into creating new or unusual spells or magic items, and they had a few suggestions they were considering for my game. Before I gave my final decisions, I was hoping to get some input from the collective genious of EN. For now, they're looking into two items in particular. First, they're wondering about a Refracted Beam spell. In other words, it works like a ranged touch Prismatic Spray, but the target it immediately hit with all seven effects, and thus has to make seven saving throws!

The second idea they had is for a type of magical arrow that has the Lower Spell Resistance spell effect on them. Those are a little easier to stat out as simple one-shot spell-casting items, but I wasn't certain of the exact procedure and was wondering if they were reasonably balanced.

 

[Lord Morte]

First, they're wondering about a Refracted Beam spell. In other words, it works like a ranged touch Prismatic Spray, but the target it immediately hit with all seven effects, and thus has to make seven saving throws!

First thought: What level would this new spell be?
Second thought: They wish to trade the ability to effect multiple targets for the ability to do considerably more to the target they do have, who they have to hit with a touch attack. I'd say either limit the number of effects that a target suffers, perhaps rolling twice of the Prismatic Spray table (plus any rerolls) and allow it as an 7th level spell. Otherwise, I'd say the spell described is about 9th level.

The second idea they had is for a type of magical arrow that has the Lower Spell Resistance spell effect on them. Those are a little easier to stat out as simple one-shot spell-casting items, but I wasn't certain of the exact procedure and was wondering if they were reasonably balanced.

Not familiar with this Lower Spell Resistance spell. Only thing comparable I know of is Assay Resistance spell in Complete Arcane, which allows the caster to penetrate the target's SR easier. Now, I'd allow a magic arrow that did THAT, using the normal formula, but I wouldn't allow an arrow that dropped SR for everyone without an increase in price.

 

[yennico]

A few of my players are really into creating new or unusual spells or magic items, and they had a few suggestions they were considering for my game. Before I gave my final decisions, I was hoping to get some input from the collective genious of EN. For now, they're looking into two items in particular. First, they're wondering about a Refracted Beam spell. In other words, it works like a ranged touch Prismatic Spray, but the target it immediately hit with all seven effects, and thus has to make seven saving throws!

Prismatic spray is a level 7 spell. Normally a target of a prismatic spray can only hit by two rays.
You want a spell which hits one target with all seven rays.
1. With a ranged touch attack a target is easier to hit than with a ranged attack
2. Seven saving throws: three reflex, two fortitude, two will. Only a character with high base saves and luck will make seven successfull saving throws.
3. You are combining seven spells into one spell The effects of your spell:
- 140 points of damage reduced by damage reduction and resistances
- 2x save or die spells (poison and polymorph into stone (if not dispel in the fight very soon))
- an insanity spell
- a banishment spell

I would not allow your spell because
a) seven saving throws for one spell is too much.
b) combing high level spells into one spell sounds like an epic spell to me.

The second idea they had is for a type of magical arrow that has the Lower Spell Resistance spell effect on them. Those are a little easier to stat out as simple one-shot spell-casting items, but I wasn't certain of the exact procedure and was wondering if they were reasonably balanced.

I agree with Lord Morte on this topic.

 

[Syndrome]

Draconomicon has a spell called Lower Spell Resistance at 4th level; Fort Negates, lowers SR for the target creature by 1/caster level (Max 15), lasts 1 min/level, SR: No, and has a range of Close. As a single shot item that would not be too expensive to make for an arrow. Using the rules for item creation in the DMG I'd price each such arrow as:

Spell Effect (Use Activated): Spell level 4th x 7th Caster Level x50 GP=1400 GP base, plus the cost of a +1 magical arrow so that it will hold the enchantment of the effect. 50 +1 arrows run about 2350 GP so about 47 GP per arrow. Net cost is 1447 GP before anything else like special materials, and assuming you only want a +1 arrow. This is a fairly weak lower resistance though, only -7 to SR. I'd suggest making them cast at 10th level or 15th level only just to keep the bonus decent. So for a 10th caster level version it would be around 2047 GP per arrow, and for 15th (max bonus for the spell), it would be 3047 per arrow. Me? I'd round off to an even GP amout of 1450, 2050, and 3050 per arrow respectively.

As to the all seven rays hit version of Prismatic Spray? No way, that's insanely powerful as Vennico has pointed out already. I would never allow that in my game, simply too abusive.

 

[LordVyreth]

It sounds like people agree that Refracted beam is way too powerful for a non-epic spell? I was thinking more or less the same thing, but I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one. I'll pass Syndrome's method for the arrows on, but I thought there were some standard magical arrows without the +1 enchantment rule?

 

[ZuulMoG]

If the Refracted Beam spell allowed half damage and avoided or lesser effects (per the Prismatic Spray spell) in one saving throw (almost certainly Fort), I'd consider allowing it as a 9th level spell. Consider. Far better to Sculpt it onto your target and force him to enter it.

 

[Nifft]

Arrows: I'd allow an arrow to reduce SR by -1 per hit, no save or SR, for the price of a +2 enhancement bonus. The penalty would stack with itself, and last for 1 day.

I'd consider it on par with the 3.5e wounding special ability, which is also +2.


Spell: yeah, it sounds Epic to me, too.


-- N

 

[Thanee]

Arrow could work as a single, triggered 3rd level spell (Planar Handbook Spell Vulnerability).

Take a look at the Contingent Spell Items in Complete Arcane, they might work well.

I think it's 100 gp x spell level (3rd) x caster level (5th+) for a one-use item with trigger.


The other one is too powerful, yes.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Syndrome]

In order to get any of the special abilities like wounding, thundering, etc requires that the weapon have an enchantment value of +1 at the very least. You can of course House Rule that if you wish, but that might seriously devalue some of the better weapons out there.