New D&D Spinner Rack

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Ah, I misunderstood you. Gotcha.

 

[Glyfair]

Ah, I misunderstood you. Gotcha.

No problem. Going back I see I wasn't specific.

I wish I could find the comment, but I read quite a few blogs and a few message boards. There are a few people I think it might have been.

 

[Jeysie]

But there's still a high initial barrier to entry. If you're trying to convince someone who's never played an RPG that they want to play D&D, the wallet quite often goes right back in the pocket when you tell them the price for the three core books.

I find that a little hard to believe, considering how expensive many other geeky hobbies are. I blinked at first when I saw the book prices, but then I realized how much money I spend on computer games and tech toys and whatnot and no longer had an issue with it.

Anyone who's ever bought a full-price video or computer game, at the very least, really has no ground for thinking D&D books are expensive.

Most of which have cheap ways to get introduced to the hobby, such as learning them in school or cheap rentals of equipment.

You mean like borrowing RP books from a friend or using the SRD? Or buying the D&D Basic Set? Or buying just the PHB at first and maybe the DMG? Or having all of the people you were thinking of gaming with chip in to buy one set for the time being?

As for sports, in addition to renting equipment you often have to pay for the space as well, every time you go. I have a friend who's into SCUBA diving and many sports. He spent far more than $100 during his SCUBA classes in college, and has spent thousands of dollars on all those sports hobbies over the years.

How much have I spent in my two and a half years of gaming so far? $100. How much will I spend in the future? Depends. Probably $30 for the Eberron Setting and maybe another $60-$100 if my group decides we like 4th Edition whenever it comes out. Considering how much I spend on novels, DVDs, and computer games - all of which offer far less replay value - that's pretty cheap.

Peace & Luv, Liz

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

I find that a little hard to believe, considering how expensive many other geeky hobbies are. I blinked at first when I saw the book prices, but then I realized how much money I spend on computer games and tech toys and whatnot and no longer had an issue with it.

Anyone who's ever bought a full-price video or computer game, at the very least, really has no ground for thinking D&D books are expensive.

Er, I bought the collector's editions of both World of Warcraft and its expansion. Each was cheaper than buying a full set of the three core books, and the CEs were $15-25 more than the cost of an undiscounted computer game.

You mean like borrowing RP books from a friend or using the SRD?

If we're talking about people entering the hobby (I am), they may not yet HAVE a friend who plays, and knowing what the heck the SRD is at all would be an accomplishment for a non-player.

Or buying the D&D Basic Set?

A good option, if they can find it. My local bookstore has dozens of RPG titles, from a pretty wide selection of publishers. They haven't had the basic set in months.

Or having all of the people you were thinking of gaming with chip in to buy one set for the time being?

Your friends must be very free with money if you can get them to chip in on something as speculative as "hey, I need $100 for some books for a game we might or might not end up playing and enjoying. Pony up."

As for sports, in addition to renting equipment you often have to pay for the space as well, every time you go. I have a friend who's into SCUBA diving and many sports. He spent far more than $100 during his SCUBA classes in college, and has spent thousands of dollars on all those sports hobbies over the years.

I'm reasonably certain he's never rented the ocean and many park and rec departments charge a nominal fee for closed water lessons, which are required for open water certification. Paying $10 to try on scuba gear and learn how to use it in a city pool is a far cry from having to go buy a full set of equipment.

There are a lot more park and rec departments offering scuba lessons out there than are running RPG games, despite the relatively low ongoing equipment costs of the latter.

For someone already gaming, yes, gaming is cheap. If we're talking about new people coming over the wall, $100 is a big hit. The basic game, while not perfect (once upon a time, basic D&D books let you make up your own characters), is a good start, but it's not anywhere as widely distributed as the higher priced "required" books.

 

[mcrow]

Whoever it was that made the comment was talking about publishers. If the publisher is only selling 1/3 of the copies he would be selling a few years ago then it doesn't matter whether those copies were sold through Amazon, hobby stores or book chains. Total sales are the indication of the hobby's health.

(It's not showing up on my search of Erik's post, but it was someone with his sort of connection to the industry).

Well, in my comment I was refering strictly to brick and mortar stores and not to publishers.

I was just stating the brick and mortar stores are down more than online store are.

 

[Jeysie]

Er, I bought the collector's editions of both World of Warcraft and its expansion. Each was cheaper than buying a full set of the three core books, and the CEs were $15-25 more than the cost of an undiscounted computer game.

Around here, undiscounted games are $50-$65. So you can spend that much money on a game that'll only last you for 15-100 hours depending on the game, or one you have to shell out an extra $10 for every month if you decide you want to keep playing. Or you can spend a little extra and get a game that'll last you as many hours as you feel like playing, and that you won't have to spend a penny more to keep playing unless you want to. *shrug*

A good option, if they can find it. My local bookstore has dozens of RPG titles, from a pretty wide selection of publishers. They haven't had the basic set in months.

Heh. Granted, I'm used to my own Barnes and Noble, where the Basic Set *is* available.

Your friends must be very free with money if you can get them to chip in on something as speculative as "hey, I need $100 for some books for a game we might or might not end up playing and enjoying. Pony up."

If we assume that you can gather four people including yourself, that's $25 per person. You can easily spend more than that per person to see a movie ($9-10 for a ticket in my area, plus popcorn and soda) that you may or may not enjoy seeing, or go out to dinner, or go to the amusement park, etc. And those are all one-shot deals, unlike RPing, and you can't sell your goods and get at least some of your money back if you decide you don't like it.

Also, when my group started, we only had one person who had played before. He owned a PHB and a DMG at the time, IIRC. Since we gamed online, the rest of us had to all buy at least our own PHBs to give it a go. So between the lot of us we pitched in around $120, not including the one guy who already played before.

I'm reasonably certain he's never rented the ocean and many park and rec departments charge a nominal fee for closed water lessons, which are required for open water certification. Paying $10 to try on scuba gear and learn how to use it in a city pool is a far cry from having to go buy a full set of equipment.

There's no ocean where I live, and it was more like $30 at least for rental and equipment. He spent a lot of money during his SCUBA college class, and that was before he bought his own equipment, which was a really huge expenditure. There's also the fact that SCUBA diving is dangerous unless you have an instructor or experienced diver with you.

Peace & Luv, Liz

 

[Harker Wade]

I'm not sure who made the comment, but I can assure that at Barnes & Noble it has less to do with what a store manager wants or doesn't want to carry then it does with how much revenue a section generates. Sections shrink or expand during the year based on sales. And that can vary greatly between stores.

My store has 4 sheleves of Manga and 4 of graphic novels becuase over the course of the last few years the store has steadily sold more and more of those products. That's not the case in every B&N. As for RPG the section has shrunk down to 1 set of shelves and the WotC spinner rack. This is not because sales are bad but because of a rash of shoplifting we had to move all of the D&D minis, Star Wars minis and dice behind the cash-rap line, another set of shelves.