Travis Henry
First Post
Hi, I played D&D in some earlier editions, but have recently started DMing with the 5E Starter Set. We only have the Basic Rules — no PHB or DMG.
I have a question about the possibility of simulating "simultaneous movement" during a single round. I figure the lack of "simultaneity" has been question in most editions of D&D.
Here's the thing. One of my players (who is mostly new to D&D) has gotten kind of miffed for how he "can't" choose to run alongside another character during an encounter. We've only been playing for a few sessions, and it's come up twice.
SPOILER ALERT FOR STARTER SET / LOST MINE OF PHANDELVER
#1) Once, in the Goblin Ambush encounter, he said he wanted to run along behind the ox cart as another character drove it down the trail. He was intending to use the moving cart as partial cover from goblin arrows. Okay makes sense. But the driver (and thus, the oxen) had a higher initiative, and though he called out "follow me!", when the oxen took a Dash, the cart was like 80' down the road by the end of the driver's turn.
So then it's the Goblins' turn and the cart is nearly out of the scene. And the running PC (who hasn't even moved yet) is standing out like sitting duck. And they target him and pepper him with arrows.
So the player is like: "I said I was going to stay with the cart, to use it for cover!"
Well, so we had a bit of a rules debate. (Neither of us being very familiar with the rules yet.)
Then I remembered the "Ready" action, and we looked it up. I was like: "Okay, if you want to run along with the cart. Then the driver would need to Ready an action to wait for you." (Kind of like Delay in 3E.)
But then we realized...on a Readied reaction, you can only move up to your Speed (In this case, 40' for the ox). So you can't Dash. (I mean, the running character could Dash on his turn, but then he'd get ahead of the cart!)
Plus, the driver would no longer be able to Dodge on their turn, since they Readied instead of Dodged.
We were all like: "Why is there no way for two characters to Dash together?"
#2) The second instance was in an assault on Cragmaw Hideout. After having scouted out the cave earlier (with heavy setbacks due to wet surprises), their plan was to run together, make an all-out Dash from the entrance, past the bridge, all the way to the top of the slope, in order to reach the pond before the Goblins could respond. Okay, makes sense.
So I have the three PC lined up at the cave entrance, ready to sprint. Roll for initiative…ready, set, go! Then I have the character with the highest initiative move first. By then end of his turn, he has Dashed past the bridge.
Then it's the Goblin's turn, who turns and shoots at that character's back.
And the player is like: "Hey, we were all planning to run together! Why am I sticking out like this? If we were running together, he could've targeted any three of us."
So, I was like: "Well, you could've Readied an action to run when the slowest party member begins to run."
But then he made the point that: "But on a Readied reaction, you can only Move your speed. You can't Dash."
Okay. So basically, the Rules As Written don't provide a way for characters to intentionally Dash simultaneously (within a combat round)…which would seem to be possible in Real Life.
***
I have read the Sage Advice about why Delay was removed from the game, since it throws a wrench into the whole concept of Initiative, and is subject to abuse especially in regard to spell durations. And I grok that.
Yet, within an encounter, there ought to be a way to intentionally do something (at least Move or Dash) simultaneously.
I basically see two non-solutions and one solution:
1) Honor the RAW, and say you can only Move together, and even then, only by the higher initiative PC Readying an action (and thus losing both their Attack and Reaction). It's impossible to Dash together. Honors the rules, but doesn't seem very true to life. People sprint next to each other in track-and-field, etc.
2) Honor the RAW, but suggest that the PCs don't bother with Readying to Move together. Just explain to the player that actually it is all simultaneous, since all the turns take place within the same 6 second round. It's just that within the game, it appears to be happening sequentially. But in the actual story, the events unfolded nearly simultaneously. But still hard to explain why the PC in front (or the PC left behind) sticks out so much as a target. As a DM I could try to keep in mind their "supposed" togetherness (which is not apparent on the playing grid) when choosing which PC to target.
3) Maybe my campaign needs two houseruled special actions: Move Together and Dash Together:
Move Together: Two or more allies, who are able to communicate, can choose to Move Together. The higher initiative PC(s) take one Action on their turn, but then use their Reaction to Move when the slowest character Moves. (In other words, they don't lose their Action by having to Ready. They only lose their Reaction.)
Dash Together: On their turn, the higher initiative PC(s) take no action (except possibly a bonus action). On the turn of the slowest PC, and they all Dash Together. This uses up the Reaction of the higher initiative PCs, but not of the slowest PC. And then the regular initiative order resumes.
…Or is simultaneous movement covered in the PHB/DMG somewhere?
I have a question about the possibility of simulating "simultaneous movement" during a single round. I figure the lack of "simultaneity" has been question in most editions of D&D.
Here's the thing. One of my players (who is mostly new to D&D) has gotten kind of miffed for how he "can't" choose to run alongside another character during an encounter. We've only been playing for a few sessions, and it's come up twice.
SPOILER ALERT FOR STARTER SET / LOST MINE OF PHANDELVER
#1) Once, in the Goblin Ambush encounter, he said he wanted to run along behind the ox cart as another character drove it down the trail. He was intending to use the moving cart as partial cover from goblin arrows. Okay makes sense. But the driver (and thus, the oxen) had a higher initiative, and though he called out "follow me!", when the oxen took a Dash, the cart was like 80' down the road by the end of the driver's turn.
So then it's the Goblins' turn and the cart is nearly out of the scene. And the running PC (who hasn't even moved yet) is standing out like sitting duck. And they target him and pepper him with arrows.
So the player is like: "I said I was going to stay with the cart, to use it for cover!"
Well, so we had a bit of a rules debate. (Neither of us being very familiar with the rules yet.)
Then I remembered the "Ready" action, and we looked it up. I was like: "Okay, if you want to run along with the cart. Then the driver would need to Ready an action to wait for you." (Kind of like Delay in 3E.)
But then we realized...on a Readied reaction, you can only move up to your Speed (In this case, 40' for the ox). So you can't Dash. (I mean, the running character could Dash on his turn, but then he'd get ahead of the cart!)
Plus, the driver would no longer be able to Dodge on their turn, since they Readied instead of Dodged.
We were all like: "Why is there no way for two characters to Dash together?"
#2) The second instance was in an assault on Cragmaw Hideout. After having scouted out the cave earlier (with heavy setbacks due to wet surprises), their plan was to run together, make an all-out Dash from the entrance, past the bridge, all the way to the top of the slope, in order to reach the pond before the Goblins could respond. Okay, makes sense.
So I have the three PC lined up at the cave entrance, ready to sprint. Roll for initiative…ready, set, go! Then I have the character with the highest initiative move first. By then end of his turn, he has Dashed past the bridge.
Then it's the Goblin's turn, who turns and shoots at that character's back.
And the player is like: "Hey, we were all planning to run together! Why am I sticking out like this? If we were running together, he could've targeted any three of us."
So, I was like: "Well, you could've Readied an action to run when the slowest party member begins to run."
But then he made the point that: "But on a Readied reaction, you can only Move your speed. You can't Dash."
Okay. So basically, the Rules As Written don't provide a way for characters to intentionally Dash simultaneously (within a combat round)…which would seem to be possible in Real Life.
***
I have read the Sage Advice about why Delay was removed from the game, since it throws a wrench into the whole concept of Initiative, and is subject to abuse especially in regard to spell durations. And I grok that.
Yet, within an encounter, there ought to be a way to intentionally do something (at least Move or Dash) simultaneously.
I basically see two non-solutions and one solution:
1) Honor the RAW, and say you can only Move together, and even then, only by the higher initiative PC Readying an action (and thus losing both their Attack and Reaction). It's impossible to Dash together. Honors the rules, but doesn't seem very true to life. People sprint next to each other in track-and-field, etc.
2) Honor the RAW, but suggest that the PCs don't bother with Readying to Move together. Just explain to the player that actually it is all simultaneous, since all the turns take place within the same 6 second round. It's just that within the game, it appears to be happening sequentially. But in the actual story, the events unfolded nearly simultaneously. But still hard to explain why the PC in front (or the PC left behind) sticks out so much as a target. As a DM I could try to keep in mind their "supposed" togetherness (which is not apparent on the playing grid) when choosing which PC to target.
3) Maybe my campaign needs two houseruled special actions: Move Together and Dash Together:
Move Together: Two or more allies, who are able to communicate, can choose to Move Together. The higher initiative PC(s) take one Action on their turn, but then use their Reaction to Move when the slowest character Moves. (In other words, they don't lose their Action by having to Ready. They only lose their Reaction.)
Dash Together: On their turn, the higher initiative PC(s) take no action (except possibly a bonus action). On the turn of the slowest PC, and they all Dash Together. This uses up the Reaction of the higher initiative PCs, but not of the slowest PC. And then the regular initiative order resumes.
…Or is simultaneous movement covered in the PHB/DMG somewhere?