New Option for Paladins

[Vrecknidj]

The thread on paladins making magic items got me to thinking about another issue. I thought about tweaking their spell progression by turning the capacity to cast paladin spells into feats. This has probably already been covered by someone else, but here's what spontaneously popped out of my early-morning brain.

All of the following are feats. Remove the Spells per Day table from the paladin class. Add a bonus feat that is granted at 1st, 6th, 9th and 12th level. Paladins may opt not to become spellcasters, doing so means they free up these bonus feats for other feats. Allow a paladin to take any Divine feat or Fighter feat for which they qualify with these bonus feats. The feats listed below generate a slightly different set of spells per day than the table in the class, but the total number of spells isn't much different. The class is still front-loaded. The original paladin class kinda loses its punch around 10th level; thereafter it's often best to just start taking levels in a prestige class that makes the person a better combatant. This set of feats doesn't really change that, although it does give the player a reason to hold on until 12th level if he wants to get that 4th level spell (which is normally acquired at 13th).

First-level Paladin Spells
Prerequisite: Pal1, Wis 11
Benefit: You may cast first-level paladin spells. The number of first-level spells you may cast per day is your paladin level divided by 4 (rounded down) plus any bonus spells granted by a high Wisdom score. (So, for example, until 4th level, you only have as many spells as are granted by your Wisdom modifier.)

Second-level Paladin Spells
Prerequisite: Pal6, Wis 12, First-level Paladin Spells
Benefit: You may cast second-level paladin spells. The number of second-level spells you may cast per day is your paladin level divided by 5 (rounded down) plus any bonus spells granted by a high Wisdom score.

Third-level Paladin Spells
Prerequisite: Pal9, Wis 13, First-level Paladin Spells, Second-level Paladin Spells
Benefit: You may cast third-level paladin spells. The number of third-level spells you may cast per day is your paladin level divided by 6 (rounded down) plus any bonus spells granted by a high Wisdom score.

Fourth-level Paladin Spells
Prerequisite: Pal12, Wis 14, First-level Paladin Spells, Second-level Paladin Spells, Third-level Paladin Spells
Benefit: You may cast fourth-level paladin spells. The number of fourth-level spells you may cast per day is your paladin level divided by 6 (rounded down) plus any bonus spells granted by a high Wisdom score.

 

[Darklone]

Holy sword at level 12? Kewl, anyone will buy that

 

[solkan_uk]

If I were doing that I'd drop the paladin completely and allow fighters to take the feats.

 

[Vrecknidj]

If I were doing that I'd drop the paladin completely and allow fighters to take the feats.

But that leaves all the rest of the paladin abilities out. Still, something to consider.

Dave

 

[smootrk]

Having all Paladin-ish abilities changed to Feat/Feat Chains is an interesting idea. Tie the feats to Alignment/Deity/Conduct Code/Etc. and you can create Holy Warriors of a wide variety of types and classes. Mix it up with some feats from other sources, like Book of Exalted Deeds, and you can create:

Holy Wizards (with Sanctified Spell (amongst other feats like this), Lay Hands, and Combo Mount/Familiar (similar to the druid/mage Prc that I cannot remember the name for)

Holy Warriors (duh... emulates the standard paladin class)

Holy Clerics (a natural, with a little more of a warrior twist (ie smites/mount)

Holy Infiltrators (rogues with smite, sneaky & deadly)

If you expand the idea and apply the abilities to other alignments, then you could have vile warriors, unholy wizards, etc... all produced from feat & feat chains.

 

[Stalker0]

Holy sword at level 12? Kewl, anyone will buy that

For 4 feats? No thank you

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

Variant Paladin : Skills-n-Feats

Curse you Solkan-UK!

Just because of you this idea has been bouncing around in my head for the last day... so I wrote it down:
Caveat: This is a day's worth of thinking.. I am sure there are loopholes with it and possibly something that will get tucked into a dark, unused corner of my HR folder

[title]Variant Paladin
A Skills-n-Feats adaptation
[/title]

Chosen of the Gods is, under normal 3.x rules, a tightly bound class. This has necessitated creation of other classes to reflect a Chosen who does not follow the same battle-ethics. As each Deity has differences, so too should their followers.

This variant disposed of the Core Paladin, Anti-Paladin, and their bastard children. Instead a character devoted to a Deity may take feats to gain the special abilities. One can replicate the Core Paladin through the Fighter class and these Feats.

New Mechanics:
New Skills:
Devotion (WIS): This skill represents your investment into your Deity, as well as your Deities investment into you. When you gain a Divine Feat, your current level of Devotion becomes a pre-requisite for that feat.
You can use this skill as a replacement for Knowledge: Religion regarding your own Deity. You can also use it to determine if a given course of action goes against your Code. The DC for this based on severity of the violation: Minor Violation DC 15. Major Violations DC 5
This skill is Exclusive and can only be accessed through the Feat ‘Chosen of the Gods’

Changed Mechanics:
Falling from Grace.
When a Chosen of the Gods goes against their Code, they may suffer a drain of Devotion Ranks. This will directly affect the abilities granted to them. If the character violates their Code, they must make a Devotion skill check vs DC 20. The amount they fail the check by is the amount of Devotion ranks that are drained.
The DC of this check is modified by the severity of the violation. A major violation increases the DC by +10. If the character knows in advance that the course of action will be a violation, the DC increases by +10.
If the character’s ranks are reduced to zero, they have fallen from grace. An ‘Atonement’ spell will return their status, or begin their status anew with a different Deity. The spell recovers 1 rank in Devotion.
Recovering drained ranks: Lesser Restoration recovers 1D4 ranks and Restoration recovers all drained ranks. However, the caster of the spell must be a Chosen of the same Deity as the character. Additionally, casting a Restoration on an unrepentant Chosen usually violates the casters own Code. As such, a quest is often required before such services will be rendered.

Feats:
Chosen of the Gods
When this feat is selected, the character must announce the Deity they are allied with and the Code by which they will live. The code at http://www.farlandworld.com/paladin.html is an excellent version. The chosen code should highlight aspects of the Deity and must be agreed upon by the DM.
Benefits: You gain Devotion as a Class skill.
You gain an Aura of Good equal to your ranks in Devotion.

Divine Grace:
Prereq: 3 ranks in Devotion
Benefits: Gain the Divine Grace Paladin class ability
Gain the Divine Health Paladin class ability

Divine Wrath:
Prereq: 3 ranks in Devotion
Benefit: Gain the Aura of Courage Paladin class ability
At will, use ‘detect evil’, as the spell. Your caster level is equal to your ranks in Devotion –3.
Gain the ability to Smith Evil {or Good} as if you had Paladin levels equal to your ranks in Devotion –3

Greater Divine Wrath
Prereq: Divine Wrath
Benefits: As a free action and expending a Smith Evil use, you can infuse your Weapon with the Holy {or Un-Holy} enhancement. This enhancement lasts a number of rounds equal to your CHR Mod.

Divine Healing
Prereq: 3 ranks in Devotion
Benefit: Gain the ‘Laying on Hands’ Paladin class ability. The amount of healing available is the number of Devotion ranks * Charisma bonus

Divine Rage
Prereq: 4 ranks in Devotion
Benefit: You can fly into a rage, gaining +4 to Strength, +4 to Constitution, and a +2 bonus to Will saves, but taking a –2 penalty to AC. Like the Barbarian rage, the new CON adds temporary hit points. Unlike the Barbarian rage, you are not limited in your choice of actions. The rage lasts a number of rounds equal to the your CHR mod and your new CON Mod added together. At the end of the rage, you become Fatigued.
You can fly into a Divine Rage only once per encounter. This ability is usable once per day for each 4 ranks of Devotion.

Divine Skill
Prereq: 3 ranks in Devotion
Benefit: You gain +2 skill points each time you level, including the level you gain this feat. These points are not retroactive.
Special: If this Feat is lost due to Falling from Grace, you lose an additional number of ranks in Devotion equal to the number of levels since gaining this feat. {This mechanic avoids the problem of tracking which skill points were spent where}

Greater Divine Healing
Prereq: Divine Healing
Benefit: You gain the ability to Remove Disease once a week per 4 ranks of Devotion. The caster level for this ability is equal to your ranks in Devotion.

Greater Divine Rage:
Prereq: Divine Rage
Benefit: The bonus gained by the Rage increases to +6 to STR and CON, and +3 to Will saves.

Tireless Divine Rage:
Prereq: Greater Divine Rage
Benefit: You are no longer Fatigued at the end of your rage

Turn Undead:
Prereq: 3 ranks of Devotion
Benefit: Gain the ability to Turn undead. You gain a virtual level of Cleric for each rank of Devotion beyond 6th. These virtual ranks stack with actual Cleric levels, however they cap at your characters total level. You can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + CHR Mod.

Domain Access:
Prereq: 3 ranks of Devotion
Benefit: Select one Domain your Deity owns. You gain the Domain Power and may select spells from the Domain list.

Spell Casting:
Prereq: 3 ranks in Devotion
Benefit: You gain the ability to cast spells from the Paladin spell list as if you had Paladin levels equal to your ranks in Devotion –3.

Divine Mount:
Prereq: 3 ranks in Devotion
Benefit: You gain a Paladin Mount as if you had Paladin levels equal to your ranks in Devotion –3


Addendums:
Changing Deities. It is possible to change deities, but this is mildly painful. You must first renounce your current Deity and accept the resulting fall from grace. Then you must gain Absolution from the new Deity. However, the new Deity cannot restore drained Devotion, so you start out at 1 rank of Devotion and must rebuild.
While rebuilding, if a previously selected Feat does not fit the new Deity, the GM may either select one for you or be nice and let you change it yourself. Options on previously selected feats, such as with Domain Power, are up to the players choice as to what to change it to.

 

[Sravoff]

Primitive Screwhead, those feats look great. I have only one comment. SHouldn't the greater versions of feats have higher devotion pre-requisites? Under the current rules, at second level you can take divine rage, at third greater divine rage, and a fourth take tireless.

I don't have any books in front of me, but doesn't the barbarian have to wait till 12th to get greater rage?

And doesn't a paladin normally not get remove disease til fourth level? Under these rules s/he can have it at level one.

I do very much like the way you have broken down these abilities into feats, something I have tried and failed to do several times.

Since the fighter gets 18 feats through 20th level, and there are 14 of these paladin feats, then the paladin built with these feats will recieve two less general feats. Though, I would guess that not all paladin builds with this would take all the feats.

All in all it looks very good. Aside from the possibility of munchkinism, it looks good. Though a smart DM could easily get around the munchkin with the code of conduct.

 

[Vrecknidj]

Very cool. I'm glad my proddings had this effect, and even mine were themselves prodded.

I'll have to give this some more thought.

Dave

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

Primitive Screwhead, those feats look great. I have only one comment. SHouldn't the greater versions of feats have higher devotion pre-requisites? Under the current rules, at second level you can take divine rage, at third greater divine rage, and a fourth take tireless.

I added the 'Greater' feats as I was retyping the variant.. Yes, they probably could have higher requirements, however is there anything wrong with a Divinely inspired Rager who does nothing else? He would have had to burn all their Feats to get to that point, and would still only be able to use it once per day.

And doesn't a paladin normally not get remove disease til fourth level? Under these rules s/he can have it at level one.

Yup... and how often have you seen a Paladin use this ability
But it too could have an upped prereq if need be.

I do very much like the way you have broken down these abilities into feats, something I have tried and failed to do several times.

Thanks!

All in all it looks very good. Aside from the possibility of munchkinism, it looks good. Though a smart DM could easily get around the munchkin with the code of conduct.

Somewhere I had a 'build your code of conduct' sheet, basically the player had to select and prioritize 10 basic tenets of thier Code. This made it pretty clear cut which tenet over-ruled which and customized the Code somewhat. This helped to avoid the hostage lose-lose scenarios.

The other aspect that makes this a more-than-likely addition to my game is the mechanical means for a Falling from Grace that is not an all-or-nothing approach. I never really liked that aspect of the core rules.

I look forward to more comments and feedback!